When to leave after section 21 (periodic tenancy)

Rollinghills

We have been given section 21 expiring 28th April (we pay rent from 29th, tenancy is periodic AST).
If we can't move by 28th April (buying a house so fc) do we then have to stay another month or can we end the tenancy on any day after section 21 expires? If so do we just inform the landlord and ask for checkout on the day we choose?

silvercar

You have to give notice of one month to end at the end of a rent period.

You can of course move out when you want, a possible overlap between completion on your purchase and renting your current home has its advantages, certainly preferable to being homeless.

SerialRenter

A section 21 does not end a tenancy. You will still need to hand in your one month's notice. Or, you can mutually agree to end the tenancy on any date you and your landlord agree on.

Rollinghills

SerialRenter wrote: »

A section 21 does not end a tenancy. You will still need to hand in your one month's notice. Or, you can mutually agree to end the tenancy on any date you and your landlord agree on.

What? Are you sure?
So when on 28th of April my landlord calls me to ask if we are moving today I'm supposed to give him my one month's notice?! Surely that can't be right! After 28th April the landlord can take us to court to get possession order - how would that work if I gave him notice at that point?

RAS

If you are in the property at 00.01am on April 29, you owe the LL a whole month's rent. Unless he agrees to an early surrender; which you must get in writing to protect yourselves.

Note he is not likely to agree now to you staying after April 28 as that invalidates the S21. He may still be prepared to agree an early surrender after that date.

Rollinghills

RAS wrote: »

If you are in the property at 00.01am on April 29, you owe the LL a whole month's rent. Unless he agrees to an early surrender; which you musdt get in writing to protect yourselves.

Note he is not likely to agree now to you staying after April 28 as that invalidates the S21. He may still be prepared to agree an early surrender after that date.

That makes sense, thank you. I hope we can complete before 28th to avoid this scenario.

SerialRenter

RAS wrote: »

If you are in the property at 00.01am on April 29, you owe the LL a whole month's rent. Unless he agrees to an early surrender; which you musdt get in writing to protect yourselves.

This.

Like i said, you can also mutually agree to surrender the tenancy. As long as you get it in writing, you won't have any problems. This could be on the 28th of april, or whenever, as long as both parties agree.

If you're buying a house, i would suggest talking to the landlord and picking a date that works for both of you. Assuming you've exchanged and have a date.

Keep your landlord in the loop so you can come to an amicable solution.

Rollinghills

SerialRenter wrote: »

This.

Keep your landlord in the loop so you can come to an amicable solution.

That will unfortunately not be possible as we've had lots of issues with the landlord (hence section 21). He is expecting us to move out by 28/04 , hopefully we can comply, we haven't exchanged yet but it's been in the works and there is no chain.

franklee

Rollinghills wrote: »

After 28th April the landlord can take us to court to get possession order - how would that work if I gave him notice at that point?

It's a tricky situation to manage. I guess a lot of it depends on the landlord's attitude and if he wants to move back in or sell. If it's to sell he may be a bit more flexible on dates.

Options are to move out at the end of the section 21 notice period, stay in a B&B or whatever with your stuff in storage.

Or Negotiate a mutually agreeable surrender of the tenancy with your landlord. However this leaves you vulnerable as it's signed on the last day and if the landlord backs out last minute and you haven't served notice you will be liable for more rent. I would make sure the negotiations over this are done in writing so you will have some defence if it falls through.

Or What I'd do is ask for at least two weeks, ideally three between exchange and completion and then serve my own one months notice once exchanged and have both properties on the go for a bit. You could even serve your own notice as a backup plan to option 2 .

I'd also take a fine toothcomb through the section 21 notice to make sure it's valid, dates right, served in time, deposit protected, prescribed information all done exactly right etc. The problem you have is that if the section 21 is valid and the landlord starts possession proceedings right after 28th April you will likely have to pay the court fee. However if you have (written so there is proof) negotiations to surrender the tenancy or if the section 21 isn't valid then hopefully you can stave off facing that fee.

SerialRenter

Righto, then i suggest you read G_M's guide here. Which will help explain precisely what you need to do when it comes to serving notice, and why its important to have paper proof of the tenancy ending.

Rollinghills

Thanks Franklee.
It is an ongoing saga with our ll and you replied on my earlier post regarding section 13 after section 21. The landlord doesn't want to move in or sell - he wants to rent it to another tenant, preferably one who does not know their legal rights and will take his bull***** (a poor recent immigrant like they have in the other flat would suit him well).

I think we have a few arguments to claim section 21 is not valid but I would rather avoid this because if it is rejected by court then we'd have to give notice. The arguments are: section 13 may invalidate it, it wasn't sent by recorded mail or by hand as per agreement, we could also counter claim retaliatory eviction.

When tenancy went periodic we didn't receive any info about the deposit. Now I know it gets automatically re-protected. But we didn't received prescribed information - do we have a claim here? How would we go about it?