Insuring a Leasehold Masionette

Charlie.pat

Hello All,

I recently bought a First Floor Maisonette in a building containing a Ground Floor and 1st Floor Maisonette.

I purchased this from the Freeholder, whom was also originally the Leaseholder, with a New 99 year Lease.

Unfortunately I had a Leak in the shower due to the Shower Seal being corroded / and this has caused some damage to the Ground Floor Flat.

I have now sealed my leak and intend to Patch up the Wall damaged downstairs as a result of the Leak from my Flat.

Due to the above, I decided to enquire with the Freeholder if the Property has Building Insurance, and to my surprise - He said NO and he said it was my responsibility.

Having enquired with several Brokers, I was advised that it is the responsibility of the Freeholder to Insure the Building as I am just a Leaseholder.

In my Lease though it states:

3.3 Insure and keep insured the demised premises against loss or damage by fire storm tempest aircraft explosion burst pipes impact by road vehicles and breakage of external plate glass in the full rebuilding value thereof in the names of the Tenant and the Landlord wit such Insurance Office as the Landlord shall determine or approve against loss or damage by fire and flood and such other risks as are normally included in a comprehensive policy to the full reinstatement value thereof and whenever required produce to the Landlord the policy or policies or such insurance and the receipt for the last premium for the same and in the event of the demised premises being damaged or destroyed by fire as won as reasonably practicable lay out the insurance moneys in the repair rebuilding or reinstatement of the demised premises.


I am really confused.

I can insure my Flat for Contents and Accidental Loss or Damage, but the Freeholder is saying I need to insure the Building. Should it not be the Freeholders responsibility as they are the Freeholder of the whole Dwelling. And if it is my responsibility, i.e. the Leaseholder, should the Bottom Floor Flat Leaseholder not contribute to this?

Any advise will be appreciate.

Regards,
Charlie

katejo

Charlie.pat wrote: »

Hello All,

I recently bought a First Floor Maisonette in a building containing a Ground Floor and 1st Floor Maisonette.

I purchased this from the Freeholder, whom was also originally the Leaseholder, with a New 99 year Lease.

Unfortunately I had a Leak in the shower due to the Shower Seal being corroded / and this has caused some damage to the Ground Floor Flat.

I have now sealed my leak and intend to Patch up the Wall damaged downstairs as a result of the Leak from my Flat.

Due to the above, I decided to enquire with the Freeholder if the Property has Building Insurance, and to my surprise - He said NO and he said it was my responsibility.

Having enquired with several Brokers, I was advised that it is the responsibility of the Freeholder to Insure the Building as I am just a Leaseholder.

In my Lease though it states:

3.3 Insure and keep insured the demised premises against loss or damage by fire storm tempest aircraft explosion burst pipes impact by road vehicles and breakage of external plate glass in the full rebuilding value thereof in the names of the Tenant and the Landlord wit such Insurance Office as the Landlord shall determine or approve against loss or damage by fire and flood and such other risks as are normally included in a comprehensive policy to the full reinstatement value thereof and whenever required produce to the Landlord the policy or policies or such insurance and the receipt for the last premium for the same and in the event of the demised premises being damaged or destroyed by fire as won as reasonably practicable lay out the insurance moneys in the repair rebuilding or reinstatement of the demised premises.


I am really confused.

I can insure my Flat for Contents and Accidental Loss or Damage, but the Freeholder is saying I need to insure the Building. Should it not be the Freeholders responsibility as they are the Freeholder of the whole Dwelling. And if it is my responsibility, i.e. the Leaseholder, should the Bottom Floor Flat Leaseholder not contribute to this?

Any advise will be appreciate.

Regards,
Charlie

Have you asked the ground floor leaseholder about the arrangement? I had a real hassle with my previous freeholder who did arrange the insurance but refused to provide proof of it even though it was my responsibility to ensure that I had insurance. You should have been told about the arrangement for building insurance before exchanging contracts.

What does it say in the lease? Mine stated that it was the freeholder's responsibility

BlaEm

Hi Charlie,

I have a similar situation with my first floor leasehold maisonette - it states in the lease that I am responsible for the buildings insurance.

I am surprised that the insurance situation was not confirmed with you during conveyancing - it is a condition of drawing mortgage funds that the building is insured at the point of exchange. What does your conveyancing information say about this?

The two lease situation was in my case solved with a contingent building insurance policy - so, in the event that the ground floor owner failed to obtain adequate building insurance, my property is still covered and I can claim against this policy if there is damage to building associated with the other flat. Again, this is something my solicitor recommended to me (I'm sure people's opinions on whether this is worthwhile or not will differ)

A few insurers do offer buildings insurance on leaseholds - check out the usual suspects (confused, moneysupermarket etc) - these policies are more expensive than freehold building insurance but they do exist. And they will just be for your property, so the other leaseholder should take out there own.

Richard_Webster

If your lease you must insure then you must insure!

Having enquired with several Brokers, I was advised that it is the responsibility of the Freeholder to Insure the Building as I am just a Leaseholder.

They haven't read your lease! They are talking about what usually happens, particua;ry with blocks of flats as opposed to a 1 up 1 down maisonette situation.

When you bought your solicitor should have explained this to you.

Whilst it is not entirely satisfactory that each leaseholder insures his own maisonette this is quite common where all the freeholder does is collect ground rent and doesn;'t have any maintenance responsisbilities - he just doesn't want the admin hassle of organising it.

katejo

Richard_Webster wrote: »

If your lease you must insure then you must insure!

They haven't read your lease! They are talking about what usually happens, particua;ry with blocks of flats as opposed to a 1 up 1 down maisonette situation.

When you bought your solicitor should have explained this to you.

Whilst it is not entirely satisfactory that each leaseholder insures his own maisonette this is quite common where all the freeholder does is collect ground rent and doesn;'t have any maintenance responsisbilities - he just doesn't want the admin hassle of organising it.

I was in a 1 up, 1 down maisonette for 12 years. When I first bought it, the freeholder told me to arrange my own so I did. Then the freehold changed hands and the new man said I had to pay for his policy but never ever provided proof that he had a policy probably because he was making money on it and ripping us off. I could only prove that I had paid him my contribution. In fact he swore at me for asking for proof. Fortunately I never had a claim to make!
I have stayed in touch with the person who bought from me. I recently found out that she has never even been given a proper copy of the lease in her name. She only has my old photocopy with the previous freeholder's name on it.

G_M

Your lease says that you must insure "wit such Insurance Office as the Landlord shall determine or approve" so

a) you need ask if he 'determines' any particular insurer or
b) suggest an insurer and get his approval

Additionally, it would make sense to coordinate with the leaseholder in the other maisenette, who will certainly have a similar clause in his lease, and find /suggest an insurer for the entire building. The two of you then split the premium.

See an insurance broker.

Charlie.pat

Thank for the feedback all. I have messaged the other Leaseholder (Downstairs), to get an idea if she insures her Maisonette or anything at all...but she never replies.

I have no problem paying the Building insurance but feel the other Leaseholder should Pay half of this - and better still - the freeholder should co-ordinate this.

Paying £400 Ground Rent for what I just don't know....Welcome to London's Property Ladder

On another note, I have the downstairs Leaseholders Tenant harassing me to re-plaster several walls. Claims the Plaster has blown resulting from the Leak, though there are no watermarks on some of the walls. I am happy to re-plaster any walls that have water marks, but could Plaster really blow on dry walls?

Charlie.pat

Hi Money Saving Newbi,

I am still stuck with my situation.

Building only contains 2 Flats, I am the Leaseholder of the Top Floor.

When contacting the GroundFloor Owner - I get nothing - absolutely no advice whatsoever, and I feel she is oblivious to the fact, or my inquiries.

Contacted the Freeholder again who constantly keeps telling me its my responsibility - though I keep saying, I am happy to insure, if they can co-ordinate this as it is not my building, and I am happy to pay my share.

I was wondering if you can recommend who you used to insure your flat - any advice will be appreciated.

Many thanks,
Charlie.

anselld

Charlie.pat wrote: »

I have no problem paying the Building insurance but feel the other Leaseholder should Pay half of this - and better still - the freeholder should co-ordinate this.

The lease says to insure the demise, ie your flat. So it is just a question of finding an insurer who is willing to do so.
Whilst it would be easier for the freeholder to coordinate that is not what is required in the lease.

Charlie.pat wrote: »

Paying £400 Ground Rent for what I just don't know....Welcome to London's Property Ladder

Ground rent is not a service. You should not expect anything in return.

Charlie.pat wrote: »

On another note, I have the downstairs Leaseholders Tenant harassing me to re-plaster several walls. Claims the Plaster has blown resulting from the Leak, though there are no watermarks on some of the walls. I am happy to re-plaster any walls that have water marks, but could Plaster really blow on dry walls?

Why are you dealing with queries from the downstairs tenant. Advise them to deal through their landlord. Perhaps then the downstairs landlord will come to realise the benefit of helping you with the insurance situation.