Final written warning

IloveNS

Hi, I'll try and keep this as brief as possible and thanks for reading

I have worked for my company for four years now and am currently undergoing assessment for bi-polar disorder. I feel that numerous incidents in work have triggered long periods of absence due to anxiety and depression. On returning to work each time I have been given formal warnings that lead up to a final written. In the final written, my union rep left his phone on record during the adjournment (while my line manager and a senior manager from another store decide my fate) which I wasn't aware of until after the final written had been issued. the first thing you hear on the recording is the senior manager calling me a name related to sterio-types of mental illness and also using the f word in the remark. following this (quite rightly) my rep was suspended however, the final still stood. Surely, they should have ATLEAST re-done that meeting? especially since what happened was of no fault of my own?
The other main incident that has affected my health, was earlier in my employment with them, working as a team leader on nights (one of 3 women) I experienced sexual harassment from my manager where he took my phone from me and tried to go through my videos and pictures while saying 'I bet youve got loads of dirty ones of yourself' on a table full of male colleagues. This made some of them feel it was ok to join in. After a very short period of this I started to experience panic attacks and was signed off by the doctor. I had a home visit with personnel and made the complaint. some time later she tells me this manager has been 'spoken to'. Not feeling this was adequate, I stepped down and went back onto days. My file has four years worth of doctors notes stating depression and anxiety, which comes under disability (and especially will be if I'm diagnosed as bi-polar) and yet I seen to have been punished for this every step of the way. I am by no means saying that work caused this, but these things have definitely not helped and have probably triggered some of the relapses in my illness. Does anyone know were I might stand with this as it just doesn't seem right. thanks for your time everyone.

badskindollheart

Sorry to hear you've had these problems OP and hope you're getting some support from GP and Home.

I'm not experienced in employment law but from an objective viewpoint, I would consider the following:

You had several warnings over sickness, which may have been attributable to work, did you ever attempt to appeal these earlier warnings?

Did you do all you could to improve your health/attendance? Eg medication, counselling etc.

Although the managers involved in your final warning were very unprofessional to have used unacceptable language, was their actual decision to give the final warning fact-based and in line with your absence procedure? I can't see any reason to hold another meeting, that would likely come to the same conclusion?

It's worth noting that having a disability doesn't exempt you from being put through absence management procedures. They may make reasonable adjustments, to allow you to improve your attendance but If the level of absence is intolerable to the business they can discipline/dismiss you.

I hope things go well for you and I'm sure someone with more knowledge than me will be along soon.

stevemLS

Post 2 may not know about employment law but they are pretty much spot on.

Undervalued

stevemLS wrote: »

Post 2 may not know about employment law but they are pretty much spot on.

I agree.

One further point, whilst depression and other mental health issues CAN be a disability for employment law purposes this is far from automatic.

OP, did you actually present your employers with formal medical evidence that your illness amounted to a disability and ask for reasonable adjustments? Simply handing in sick notes is unlikely to be sufficient.

Were you seen by an occupational health specialist? If so, did you give them permission to contact your own doctors for a formal report?

Undervalued

IloveNS wrote: »

In the final written, my union rep left his phone on record during the adjournment (while my line manager and a senior manager from another store decide my fate)

That is potentially a criminal offence and most unlikely to be admitted as evidence if this ended up at an employment tribunal.

It is not illegal to record, even secretly, a conversation you are party to (although there are potential civil law issues) but as soon as you are not present it amounts to "bugging".

IloveNS

I'm currently working with my GP to get a full report for work. They have evidence of counselling I have received and medication. Iv'e been on numerous anti-depressants for two years and now that bi-polar is looking likely, those medicines have been incorrect for my treatment so have just been changed yet again.
From what my union and the disability act says, a disability is when suffering has been for over a year.
It just seems that the circumstances of my employment (i.e manager on nights and being discriminated against in a formal meeting) have not been taken into consideration. This is a massive corporation I am talking about.

Work have mentioned OH but not in terms of support for me but so that they can access my medical records, which to be honest, frightens the life out of me as I don't trust them.

In terms of reasonable adjustment, I asked that I be moved onto shifts which don't involve me coming into contact with the night manager. this was agreed and shifts changed however, this has been breached multiple times and the said manager arriving to release a day manager. with me left alone in the store with him as the only manager. I was also told to take short breaks when things were getting too much and on doing this, I have received informals. I have also dropped a day in order to improve my attendance. I also recently asked for some unpaid time off to allow for the adjustment period with my medication and was refused.
By the looks of the replies, I'll probably be fired and with good reason.

Takeaway_Addict

badskindollheart wrote: »

Sorry to hear you've had these problems OP and hope you're getting some support from GP and Home.

I'm not experienced in employment law but from an objective viewpoint, I would consider the following:

You had several warnings over sickness, which may have been attributable to work, did you ever attempt to appeal these earlier warnings?

Did you do all you could to improve your health/attendance? Eg medication, counselling etc.

Although the managers involved in your final warning were very unprofessional to have used unacceptable language, was their actual decision to give the final warning fact-based and in line with your absence procedure? I can't see any reason to hold another meeting, that would likely come to the same conclusion?

It's worth noting that having a disability doesn't exempt you from being put through absence management procedures. They may make reasonable adjustments, to allow you to improve your attendance but If the level of absence is intolerable to the business they can discipline/dismiss you.

I hope things go well for you and I'm sure someone with more knowledge than me will be along soon.

An employer must make reasonable adjustments, not may. The issue is, is what is reasonable.

OP, get out and do another job. I never get why people stay in jobs longer than absolutely neccersary and sorry OP, you could have found another job in the last 4 years, even if it paid less.

Takeaway_Addict

IloveNS wrote: »

I'm currently working with my GP to get a full report for work. They have evidence of counselling I have received and medication. Iv'e been on numerous anti-depressants for two years and now that bi-polar is looking likely, those medicines have been incorrect for my treatment so have just been changed yet again.
From what my union and the disability act says, a disability is when suffering has been for over a year.
It just seems that the circumstances of my employment (i.e manager on nights and being discriminated against in a formal meeting) have not been taken into consideration. This is a massive corporation I am talking about.

Work have mentioned OH but not in terms of support for me but so that they can access my medical records, which to be honest, frightens the life out of me as I don't trust them.

In terms of reasonable adjustment, I asked that I be moved onto shifts which don't involve me coming into contact with the night manager. this was agreed and shifts changed however, this has been breached multiple times and the said manager arriving to release a day manager. with me left alone in the store with him as the only manager. I was also told to take short breaks when things were getting too much and on doing this, I have received informals. I have also dropped a day in order to improve my attendance. I also recently asked for some unpaid time off to allow for the adjustment period with my medication and was refused.
By the looks of the replies, I'll probably be fired and with good reason.

Sorry, it does sound like they have made reasonable adjustments, they have moved your shifts so you have minimal contact with the manager, not sure you can expect total non contact with them unless they move you to a different area of work and they don't have to do this if there are no jobs.

Did you actually inform people of needing a short break or did you just go off? It it were the latter then I can see the issue, if the former then not so.

badskindollheart

[QUOTE
By the looks of the replies, I'll probably be fired and with good reason.[/QUOTE]

Please don't give up on yourself:o If I'm understanding your first post correctly, then you are on a final warning they are not at the stage of dismissing you. This is your 'last chance' to improve your attendance, whilst that might feel difficult with your health problems, you still need to try. Work with your employer to see what help they can offer and don't allow yourself to become a 'victim' to your health complaints.

Many, many people with mental health problems, including bipolar, can still have productive working lives. Explain that your treatment may be changing and hopefully that will stabilize your mood, allowing you to have better attendance.

I understand that that will have been difficult to face the manager from the night shift. I've been in a similar situation but I accept that the company can't guarantee I'll never work with, or encounter, the person who mistreated me. For me, I just remember that I have the moral high ground, I know he was disciplined and he means nothing to me.

Be resilient, this is a blip; you can overcome it

Another_not_new_user

I am afraid I agree - move on and save yourself a lot of stress. The one - and it is ONLY one - case wherein an illegally procured recording (bugging) was deemed evidence only due to a public interest, and that is a very narrow legal definition which is almost certainly not going to apply here. To be honest the union rep has risked his job, his position, his unions credibility (to say nothing of their bills) and YOUR JOB since there is no evidence you didn't know about what he did. Appalling behaviour.


But I am afraid that disability or not, the best you can hope for is some adjustment to absence management triggers - not being let off entirely. You have been repeatedly off sick - I am afraid that the employer doesn't have to allow that, no matter what. And what may have happened in the past is no longer relevant - you should have dealt with that at the time. Now it is too late.


Put this behind you and get your health in order first - a dismissal due to sickness is recoverable from, but first you have to show that you have recovered. No point, therefore, in dwelling on it. Look after yourself now.