We'd like to remind Forumites to please avoid political debate on the Forum... Read More »
IMPORTANT: Please make sure your posts do not contain any personally identifiable information (both your own and that of others). When uploading images, please take care that you have redacted all personal information including number plates, reference numbers and QR codes (which may reveal vehicle information when scanned).
We're aware that some users are experiencing technical issues which the team are working to resolve. See the Community Noticeboard for more info. Thank you for your patience.
📨 Have you signed up to the Forum's new Email Digest yet? Get a selection of trending threads sent straight to your inbox daily, weekly or monthly!
The Interview with BPA
Options
Dublindel
Posts: 406 Forumite
It is about 1:21 in. Iain Lee is interviewing Dave Smith from the British Parking Association.
Iain Lee: But those ones that for for a hundred quid fine for being fifteen minutes over, it's a bit tight isn't it?
David Smith: Yes I think 15 minutes is, is, is a little, a little !..and I think most motorists wouldn't receive a ticket for that..overstay 15 minutes
I: But they do it's automatically generated isn't it? By a computer so there is no human element going "Well this is only 5,10,15 minutes we'll let them off"; it's generated automatically
No there's always a human element involved. I've seen behind the scenes where these operations take place and you know it's not in these companies interests to issue a ticket that is wrong. They will want to make sure they are providing a service on behalf of the landowner
I: Well 15 minutes wouldn't be wrong and we know that it does happen so how is that justified?
!Well, its not justified,!I mean...
I: So why do they do it?
Well the parking operators are managing the land on behalf of a landowner, typically a retailer. They're providing a service to the landowner. What we don't want is a situation where motorists are parking all day every day in a car park they're not actually using the service available
I: But you've still not quite answered the question. Why is is fair to fine someone £100 for being 15 minutes over when they've spend a few hundred quid in the shop?
Well I mean its not always £100. I mean there are guidelines in place and we recommend that the maximum charge is £100...
I: Ok
...its around £80, £75 and then there's a discount as well to 40%. If people feel the ticket is unfair they can appeal that ticket.
I: I'm going to ask the question one more time Dave because maybe you're not hearing. Why do you think its acceptable to fine people up to £100 if they are 15 minutes over their limit?
Well it doesn't happen. In the majority of cases...
I: Well it does happen though. We know it happens. We've just spoken to someone who has instances of it happening. So why do you think its fair?
Well if it isn't fair Iain, then people should appeal that ticket and there are processes in place to allow them to do that.
I: Why do YOU think its fair?
!I don't think it's fair!that...
I: So it's unfair. You're from the British Parking Association and you're saying its unfair that people who are 15 minutes over the limit should be fined £100. Up to £100.
It simply isn't the case in the majority of instances
I: No but it happens and you just said its unfair
It happens in a minority of cases
I: Is it unfair?
It happens, but it isn't the norm Iain. It isn't something that happens...
I: Ok those minority of cases it happens, is it unfair?
That's for the appeals service to decide
I: Well not you from the...you can give me your opinion as someone from the British Parking Association. Is it unfair?
There are so many different instances that...
I: Ok here's an instance. Someone has parked for 15 minutes longer than they should have done. they get a fine of lets say £80. Is that fair?
As the current situation stands that is what motorists have to contend with and they should appeal that ticket if they think its unfair.
I: But is it (laughs) is it fair?
Iain it's not for us to decide it's for the appeals service to decide.
I: But you did just say it was unfair a minute ago and you seem to be backtracking
Well no, well no I'm just thinking about what I said and um er...
I: You're regretting it? So you thought it was unfair, then you reconsidered it and now you think its fair?
No, no, no you're twisting my words I'm afraid.
I: Ok, well you did say its unfair. That's not twisting, that's what you said.
I think what I'm saying is that there is a process in place for any motorist...
I: (laughs)
...who wants to appeal a ticket...
I: Right
...and it's for the appeals service to decide whether that ticket issued was fair or not.
I: Ok. Making it difficult for people to go shopping and do things isn't it?
Well no I think we've got to think about the landowner here. The landowner is providing a service for the motorist and what we don't want is a situation where the cost of that charge is £10..£20 and therefore the motorist says "Oh well I'll just park here all day then as I'm happy with that cost"
I: Yes yes, its a nice little earner isn't it?
I don't think so no.
I: How much do these companies make?
Parking is never free Iain we have to realise that
I: How much do these companies make Dave?
Well it varies you know
I: Well go on then give us an example
I don't know. I mean I don't know the financial figures of all these companies. That's not the way we operate, We're a membership association
I: Right cos a private landowner isn't going to do it for free are they?
Parking isn't free
I: Its a business
Well I think the misconception is that parking is free. A free parking space costs money. The cost of providing that service is the...
I: How much does it cost?
It depends. It depends on what the operator says that it costs
I: What about this thing that we've heard that if you get one of these they are not enforceable by law?
Well I mean they have to justify their costs to us
I: Are these fines sent out by these private parking companies...are they enforceable by law
!They are not enforceable by law!because...
I: So then why would anyone want to pay them
Because they are parking in a car park
I: Right
They are agreeing to the terms and conditions in that car park which are clearly set out in signage at the entrance to the car park and throughout the car park. Those guidelines are in place and they should be adhered to.
I: But if its not legally enforceable - and thanks for telling everyone that Dave because that's certainly going to help a lot of people - then you get one of these fines through the letterbox you might as well just rip it up if they can't enforce it. No ones going to pay it voluntarily are they?
Well they can be pursued by the parking company
I: But if its not legally enforceable whats that pursuance going to do apart from be classified as harassment?
Well no, !it's not harassment it's..they've agreed when they park in that car park to abide by the terms and conditions; then they are agreeing in a contract...
I: You've just said it's not legally enforceable
What I'm saying is legislation doesn't exist on private land in the same way that...
I: So its not legally enforceable?
Well no. There is no legislation that exists...
I: So don't pay it then
What we would like to see is for government to regulate private parking
I: Well! One final question Dave. If someone is 15 minutes over their limit is it fair they should get an £85 fine?
It depends on circumstances of that particular parking act
I: Dave thank you very much indeed.
Iain Lee: But those ones that for for a hundred quid fine for being fifteen minutes over, it's a bit tight isn't it?
David Smith: Yes I think 15 minutes is, is, is a little, a little !..and I think most motorists wouldn't receive a ticket for that..overstay 15 minutes
I: But they do it's automatically generated isn't it? By a computer so there is no human element going "Well this is only 5,10,15 minutes we'll let them off"; it's generated automatically
No there's always a human element involved. I've seen behind the scenes where these operations take place and you know it's not in these companies interests to issue a ticket that is wrong. They will want to make sure they are providing a service on behalf of the landownerI: Well 15 minutes wouldn't be wrong and we know that it does happen so how is that justified?
!Well, its not justified,!I mean...I: So why do they do it?
Well the parking operators are managing the land on behalf of a landowner, typically a retailer. They're providing a service to the landowner. What we don't want is a situation where motorists are parking all day every day in a car park they're not actually using the service availableI: But you've still not quite answered the question. Why is is fair to fine someone £100 for being 15 minutes over when they've spend a few hundred quid in the shop?
Well I mean its not always £100. I mean there are guidelines in place and we recommend that the maximum charge is £100...I: Ok
...its around £80, £75 and then there's a discount as well to 40%. If people feel the ticket is unfair they can appeal that ticket.I: I'm going to ask the question one more time Dave because maybe you're not hearing. Why do you think its acceptable to fine people up to £100 if they are 15 minutes over their limit?
Well it doesn't happen. In the majority of cases...I: Well it does happen though. We know it happens. We've just spoken to someone who has instances of it happening. So why do you think its fair?
Well if it isn't fair Iain, then people should appeal that ticket and there are processes in place to allow them to do that.I: Why do YOU think its fair?
!I don't think it's fair!that...I: So it's unfair. You're from the British Parking Association and you're saying its unfair that people who are 15 minutes over the limit should be fined £100. Up to £100.
It simply isn't the case in the majority of instancesI: No but it happens and you just said its unfair
It happens in a minority of casesI: Is it unfair?
It happens, but it isn't the norm Iain. It isn't something that happens...I: Ok those minority of cases it happens, is it unfair?
That's for the appeals service to decideI: Well not you from the...you can give me your opinion as someone from the British Parking Association. Is it unfair?
There are so many different instances that...I: Ok here's an instance. Someone has parked for 15 minutes longer than they should have done. they get a fine of lets say £80. Is that fair?
As the current situation stands that is what motorists have to contend with and they should appeal that ticket if they think its unfair.I: But is it (laughs) is it fair?
Iain it's not for us to decide it's for the appeals service to decide.I: But you did just say it was unfair a minute ago and you seem to be backtracking
Well no, well no I'm just thinking about what I said and um er...I: You're regretting it? So you thought it was unfair, then you reconsidered it and now you think its fair?
No, no, no you're twisting my words I'm afraid.I: Ok, well you did say its unfair. That's not twisting, that's what you said.
I think what I'm saying is that there is a process in place for any motorist...I: (laughs)
...who wants to appeal a ticket...I: Right
...and it's for the appeals service to decide whether that ticket issued was fair or not.I: Ok. Making it difficult for people to go shopping and do things isn't it?
Well no I think we've got to think about the landowner here. The landowner is providing a service for the motorist and what we don't want is a situation where the cost of that charge is £10..£20 and therefore the motorist says "Oh well I'll just park here all day then as I'm happy with that cost"I: Yes yes, its a nice little earner isn't it?
I don't think so no.I: How much do these companies make?
Parking is never free Iain we have to realise thatI: How much do these companies make Dave?
Well it varies you knowI: Well go on then give us an example
I don't know. I mean I don't know the financial figures of all these companies. That's not the way we operate, We're a membership associationI: Right cos a private landowner isn't going to do it for free are they?
Parking isn't freeI: Its a business
Well I think the misconception is that parking is free. A free parking space costs money. The cost of providing that service is the...I: How much does it cost?
It depends. It depends on what the operator says that it costsI: What about this thing that we've heard that if you get one of these they are not enforceable by law?
Well I mean they have to justify their costs to usI: Are these fines sent out by these private parking companies...are they enforceable by law
!They are not enforceable by law!because...I: So then why would anyone want to pay them
Because they are parking in a car parkI: Right
They are agreeing to the terms and conditions in that car park which are clearly set out in signage at the entrance to the car park and throughout the car park. Those guidelines are in place and they should be adhered to.I: But if its not legally enforceable - and thanks for telling everyone that Dave because that's certainly going to help a lot of people - then you get one of these fines through the letterbox you might as well just rip it up if they can't enforce it. No ones going to pay it voluntarily are they?
Well they can be pursued by the parking companyI: But if its not legally enforceable whats that pursuance going to do apart from be classified as harassment?
Well no, !it's not harassment it's..they've agreed when they park in that car park to abide by the terms and conditions; then they are agreeing in a contract...I: You've just said it's not legally enforceable
What I'm saying is legislation doesn't exist on private land in the same way that...I: So its not legally enforceable?
Well no. There is no legislation that exists...I: So don't pay it then
What we would like to see is for government to regulate private parkingI: Well! One final question Dave. If someone is 15 minutes over their limit is it fair they should get an £85 fine?
It depends on circumstances of that particular parking actI: Dave thank you very much indeed.
0
Comments
-
I would suggest that the above is copied and pasted into every appeal from now on.0
-
Nice to see that he thinks the Terms and Conditions are just guidlines, possibly along the lines of The Pirates Code? Quite appropriate really.
Hope you don't mind, I've shared it with pepipoo, don't see why we should have all the fun.I'd rather be an Optimist and be proved wrong than a Pessimist and be proved right.0 -
Pepipoo - Good idea and CAG. I will be attaching this to appeals I am handling at the moment for some associates.0
-
I feel dirty that such an incompetent moron such as Dave Smith has actually looked at my LinkedIn profile :eek:"The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis." - Dante Alighieri0
-
Don't feel that way.... Dave Smith is now our FRIEND lol0
-
I've loved Iain Lee since the Eleven O Clock Show, and I love him even more now. Well done.Je Suis Cecil.0
-
It is with not a little surprise and with great disappointment I see that the BPA has not yet made reference to this interview on the "Media Activity" page of their website...
And does anyone else miss the "Monday Musing"?0 -
Zero_Gravitas wrote: »And does anyone else miss the "Monday Musing"?
I do miss the Bullpoo Purveyors Association's Tuesday Tosh, particularly the analysis of the ways that the genuine questions posed slip into self congratulatory platitudes.Je suis Charlie0 -
Instructions on how to shoot oneself in the foot....select a radio station preferably one with a presenter who knows how to "grill" some so called "expert...select a question that so called expert will have quite some difficulty answering although its relatively quite a simple answer....keep asking the same question and watch or listen as so called expert loads his weapon of choice(mouth) with selected ammunition(in this case b$$$$$$$t) and then watch or listen as so called expert give his answer.....stop laughing you lot reading this!!! and you can almost hear the noose tightening around his neck as his bosses at the British Parking Anarchists Association screem in agony along with so called expert for having such a bad attack of verbal dire ear(sorry no good at spellin)...utterably laughable...what I want to know is "where in the British Parking Anarchists !!!" are they going to find the "human element" ? Please forgive me for being cylindrical and factitious/fructose/...aw F£££ it, I just cant spell but im sure you know what I mean. Don't think he will be allowed to open his gob on a radio/tv station again!!!...stop laughing you lot! Its not funny laughing at caged animals! Dave Smith ? If youre reading this, then come on here and try to explain to the Pepipoo members what you were trying to explain.Sometimes life can be a bit of a drag but then you get little snippets like this. Oh and while youre about it Dave..may I call you dave or is it Rodney?..look up some of these words in the OED for your clarification....Justified,Human element,unfair,fair,minority,norm,,legislation,legally enforceable,ET-AL...and you may, Dave/Rodney think of some yourself that you and the monkeys don't quite understand..you ARE a plonker Rodney.
Je Suis Husheechee0 -
0
This discussion has been closed.
Confirm your email address to Create Threads and Reply
Categories
- All Categories
- 350.9K Banking & Borrowing
- 253.1K Reduce Debt & Boost Income
- 453.5K Spending & Discounts
- 243.9K Work, Benefits & Business
- 598.7K Mortgages, Homes & Bills
- 176.9K Life & Family
- 257.1K Travel & Transport
- 1.5M Hobbies & Leisure
- 16.1K Discuss & Feedback
- 37.6K Read-Only Boards