Railways, Tramways, Busways, Driverless Vehicles

modsandmockers

You seem to be saying that the majority of people who cycle to work do so for some other reason than health and enjoyment.

Yes - it’s cheaper, and sometimes quicker.

Are you suggesting that these driverless pods will be as cheap to ride in as propelling oneself on a cycle?

Pricing will depend upon local subsidies, and other political/environmental considerations.

If that is not what you are saying, then why will all these reluctant cycling commuters choose to ride in these new-fangled things?

Because ‘new-fangled’ usually turns out to mean ‘better’.

esuhl

modsandmockers wrote: »

Let’s not try to create yet another argument about whether or not cycling is capable of saving the world. The intention of the thread is to try to imagine some possible ways in which public transport might develop in the future.

What?! Are you feebly attempting to respond to Exile_geordie's post?! What does "saving the world" mean? And what the hell has it got to do with anything Exile_geordie said?!

Clearly most people who cycle choose to cycle. Otherwise they'd be in taxis!

Are you saying that cyclists hate people so much that they would never get in a taxi driven by a human being, but when driverless pods come along, they'll universally ditch their bikes?! :rotfl:

johnjp

A few years back I had a chat with Norman Baker, then newly installed as transport minister, about perhaps looking at the benefit of a busway linking the Sussex county town of Lewes to Uckfield. He thought I was a nutter to even contemplate it!
There has been a v e r y long campaign to re-open the railway and all the costs of feasibility studies must be getting close to the actual cost of a busway.
One point of busways is that they can run express between towns and then go on to local roads in town allowing for more of a door-to-door service., and infrastructure fixed costs would be significantly less.
I won't con-dem Norman completely, he may have changed his mind recently as another feasibility study costing £100,000 has recently been announced and I think he is getting tired of all the delays to what is a very important issue.

modsandmockers

Quite a lot of busways are constructed on the remains of the railway branch lines which were axed by Doctor Beeching. At the time of the Beeching cuts, car ownership was still a new idea, and the roads could easily cope with extra buses.

The railway industry continues to operate an outdated and expensive system of signal boxes and level crossing gates which, on lightly-used branch lines, serves no useful purpose. Bring on the busways!

johnjp

One suggestion in the beeching report was that every driver in the country could be given a new mini at less cost than rail upgades.

anotheruser

modsandmockers wrote: »

Johnmcl7 wrote: »

...it's not going to be remotely viable for them to drop down to the speeds trams do in shared areas just for level crossings.

Why?
Why should dozens of road-users be held up for several minutes 'just for a (nearly empty/1 or 2 carriage) train'?

So THAT'S what this topic is really about...

Depends what you consider useful. If that train gets full at peak times and at the end of the year is in the black profit wise, I would suggest it serves a purpose.

If road users don't want to wait - find another route.

Another question is: why should hundreds, thousands of road users be held up for sometimes hours, for other road users making mistakes and having crashes?

However, our country will miss the trick with HS2, as it will with roads and that is we're not thinking big enough for future proof. I am a fan of HS2 as it will be good for long distance travel but unless the trains are:

1) Maglev
2) Built ready for double-deck trains
3) At least 300mph, then there really is no point.

Having trains that will travel at near on 200mph isn't much to bother with as by the time the thing is built, that will be slow.

Same with roads.
Why we're bothering with old road technology, I don't know. We should be looking at iRobot sort of roads - note, not the cars. By the time we've done that, flying cars will be around, so fast forward to The Fifth Element sort of world.

We have the technology for both - why we continue to look at the past and bolt on to an ageing infrastructure, I don't know.

modsandmockers

ANOTHERUSER - you make some good points - here are some more of my ideas...

QUOTE - So THAT'S what this topic is really about…

It’s intended to be about bringing public transport into the 21st century - many rural branch lines have become an expensive anachronism dating from the century before last.

QUOTE - Depends what you consider useful. If that train gets full at peak times and at the end of the year is in the black profit wise, I would suggest it serves a purpose.

At level crossings, it ought to be possible to switch the priorities according to the time of day.

QUOTE - Another question is: why should hundreds, thousands of road users be held up for sometimes hours, for other road users making mistakes and having crashes?

I have often wondered why it is not normal for people who have missed important meetings/job interviews/flight times etc etc to sue the insurance company of whoever caused the hold-up.

QUOTE - However, our country will miss the trick with HS2, as it will with roads and that is we're not thinking big enough for future proof…. Having trains that will travel at near on 200mph isn't much to bother with as by the time the thing is built, that will be slow.

I agree with you that HS2 is, so far, a half-hearted idea - if it’s worth doing at all, then it’s worth doing properly, and that probably means taking it right through to Glasgow and Edinburgh.

QUOTE - Why we're bothering with old road technology, I don't know. We should be looking at iRobot sort of roads - note, not the cars. By the time we've done that, flying cars will be around, so fast forward to The Fifth Element sort of world.

Here is a quote from a post I made earlier in the thread - “I can imagine a motorway being equipped with some kind of computer-controlled underground or overhead remote control system which would automatically take over from the vehicle's driver whilst the vehicle is still on the slip road. The driver would then be able to sit back, open the laptop, read the paper, talk on the phone etc whilst the computer system would organise the motorway's traffic flows”.

QUOTE - We have the technology for both - why we continue to look at the past and bolt on to an ageing infrastructure, I don't know.

That takes us straight back to the issue of under-used railway branch lines whose greatest effect is to delay road users.

Elfbert

modsandmockers wrote: »

QUOTE - Another question is: why should hundreds, thousands of road users be held up for sometimes hours, for other road users making mistakes and having crashes?

I have often wondered why it is not normal for people who have missed important meetings/job interviews/flight times etc etc to sue the insurance company of whoever caused the hold-up.

I would love to see the very British queue forming behind the driver who's being scooped out of the ditch and into an ambulance with everyone ready to write down his/her details to put in a claim...

Mind you, think of the job prospects - we'd need thousands and thousands more people in insurance to deal with all the claims! Maybe you are onto a winner, Mods :T... as long as they could all tele-commute, and not clog up the roads/rails/pavements/skies themselves, obviously.

modsandmockers

Elfbert wrote: »

think of the job prospects - we'd need thousands and thousands more people in insurance to deal with all the claims!

Yes - and don't forget how many more lawyers would be needed...

Jeff_Bridges_hair

modsandmockers wrote: »

In cities, I think that the vast majority of people (including cyclists) would prefer a driverless pod to a bike. It is a small minority of people who currently regard cycling as the most healthy and enjoyable way to get to work and back..

Wow that's some statement there. Care to back it up?


Given I live in the biggest city in the UK I have even given up getting the tube to and from work along with many others round where I live because cycling is so much better and funnily enough , less overcrowded. Even in bad weather like today I cycled in.


And there's no way a driverless pod will make me change my mind.