Salmond and Sturgeon Want the English Fish for More Fat Subsidies

.string.

On jobs at Fastlane, the following report, published the year after that if Shakey's link gives some figures:

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/13087509.Labour_claims_19_000_Scottish_jobs_depend_on_Faslane/

It's not clear how many jobs are directly attributable to Trudent because there are other activities on minsweepers, other types of submarines and presumably other Navy Jobs.

The total at that time was around 17000 to 19000 jobs.

All these jobs would go away from Natland.

How many would go if Trident was scrapped is more open to debate, but it would be a lot.

To those jobs in the Glasgow area should be added the increases due to further submarine activities and the reward of some RN Ship Contracts, taken in hand since the No result of the referendum.

.string.

Shakethedisease wrote: »

If the SNP are returned in May. It won't be a vote for independence.. just an option. If people don't like the idea, there are a range of other parties to vote for.

Somehow, you keep missing this. And it's the most basic facet of democracy. If people don't want the option of a possible further independence referendum.. then they will vote for a party that explicitly isn't offering one.

It's not the SNP's fault if people vote for them is it ? Or have we in Scotland missed something along the way ? We can vote for who we like string. If the SNP have an option of calling a referendum in their manifesto, people are perfectly at liberty not to vote for them if that's not what they'd like in the future. I'm not quite sure why you find the above so hard to follow to be honest. Nor why you would dismiss YouGov, Ipsos Mori, Survnation, Comres, ICM etc etc as crap lol.

Somehow you keep dodging the issue.

The post I quoted was, in my opinion, prejudiced drivel and more indicative of SNP spin than clear objective thought.

I wasn't giving an opinion on polls, but I did forecast the tendency to talk about polls regardless of the discussion point.



Trying "Shakey Mode" on for size, I can add, as a total irrelevance:

Did you hear about the result of the Poll in Swansea about whether white bread was tastier than rice? Some put the result down to anti Scottish sentiment, but I can't find the ploll to check.

kabayiri

Generali wrote: »

The Unions Unite and the GMB have already made it clear that there are 10,000s of jobs in Britain relating to the Trident replacement that they will fight any attempt to scrap. Between them they're 1/3rd of the TUC.

Typically, for every £1 spent on defence in the past, it has generated £2 in revenue, much of it export led.

The last quarter of a century has seen much more modularisation in the weapons platforms seen in Nuclear submarines. This means that R&D work performed in one area could see much wider reuse on something like a minesweeper. Sonar development is a classic example of this.

Generali

kabayiri wrote: »

Typically, for every £1 spent on defence in the past, it has generated £2 in revenue, much of it export led.

The last quarter of a century has seen much more modularisation in the weapons platforms seen in Nuclear submarines. This means that R&D work performed in one area could see much wider reuse on something like a minesweeper. Sonar development is a classic example of this.

I dread to think how stupid the argument that runs against your point is going to be, assuming it gets answered at all. I suspect it will be a poll.

8/10 cats prefer Whiskers lest we forget (2/10 prefer Leslie Judd).

kabayiri

Generali wrote: »

I dread to think how stupid the argument that runs against your point is going to be, assuming it gets answered at all. I suspect it will be a poll.

8/10 cats prefer Whiskers lest we forget (2/10 prefer Leslie Judd).

I've never worked on nuclear submarine systems, only on aircraft radar.

I did work with one of the biggest defence contractors in the US, which has a 50 year history with nuclear submarine development.

I remember casually comparing the complexity of tracking multiple targets with some of my colleagues in the US. I remember one guy laughing (in a polite way). He proceeded to explain in just a few simplified pointers, why he felt justified in saying that the nuclear submarine was one of the most complicated man made devices on the planet.

I can't imagine achieving design and build of such a vessel with just 500 people.

Generali

kabayiri wrote: »

I've never worked on nuclear submarine systems, only on aircraft radar.

I did work with one of the biggest defence contractors in the US, which has a 50 year history with nuclear submarine development.

I remember casually comparing the complexity of tracking multiple targets with some of my colleagues in the US. I remember one guy laughing (in a polite way). He proceeded to explain in just a few simplified pointers, why he felt justified in saying that the nuclear submarine was one of the most complicated man made devices on the planet.

I can't imagine achieving design and build of such a vessel with just 500 people.

Any thought as how many would be needed to keep a small fleet running...1k, 5k, 10k, 50k, 100k...?

kabayiri

Generali wrote: »

Any thought as how many would be needed to keep a small fleet running...1k, 5k, 10k, 50k, 100k...?

I don't know about maintenance, sorry.

Shakey believes it to be 500 or so. I wonder if that includes the recent refit/fixes to a couple of the submarines; they cost about £300m a time.

Generali

kabayiri wrote: »

I don't know about maintenance, sorry.

Shakey believes it to be 500 or so. I wonder if that includes the recent refit/fixes to a couple of the submarines; they cost about £300m a time.

Nice work if you can get it even if you do shell out a bit for parts!

.string.

kabayiri wrote: »

I don't know about maintenance, sorry.

Shakey believes it to be 500 or so. I wonder if that includes the recent refit/fixes to a couple of the submarines; they cost about £300m a time.

It comes from an MOD report circa 2012/13 which refers to civilian jobs directly involved in Trident, but " .... that number doesn’t give a true picture of the situation. It leaves out military personnel as well as “the vast majority of jobs at Faslane which support the deterrent, the Vanguard submarines and the infrastructure which keeps the deterrent operational”."

See here:
http://blogs.channel4.com/factcheck/factcheck-should-we-scrap-trident/13202

Shakey will be stoutly defending the figure of 520 because that is SNP Holy writ so I don't think we will get insight there, maybe a poll or two.

.string.

So English Votes for English Laws has been used for the Housing and Planning Bill.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-35295404


@Shakey - what is there in the subject matter of that which is not English + Welsh only? Not general spin please, but specifics.