Salmond and Sturgeon Want the English Fish for More Fat Subsidies

Shakethedisease

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

A rabid pro-SNP author writing in the only paper to come out in favour of Yes, from a media group that owns the new Nationalist paper.

Vested Interest if ever there was one.

The Herald Hamish. And I included Suzanne Moore's opinion piece in the Guardian as well. Iain McWhirter may have been a ( reluctant ) Yes voter. But he's never been shy at criticsing the SNP.

He was writing about 'Rivers of Blood' and elements of racism being introduced into mainstream (English only) media recently about Scots in terms of the election coming up. He wasn't talking about the SNP or the referendum vote.

Shakethedisease

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

Do you support a 15p on the pound rise in income tax so Scotland can balance the books?

(it's less than half that in the rest of the UK)

Is that likely to happen in May ? I thought you said independence was off the agenda for another 20 or 30 years ? Why would Scotland need to balance it's books if that were true.

And if it's not true... then you must think it's round the corner sometime soon ?

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

Shakethedisease wrote: »

Is that likely to happen in May ? I thought you said independence was off the agenda for another 20 or 30 years ? Why would Scotland need to balance it's books if that were true.

You lot keep asking for, lobbying for, campaigning for, full fiscal autonomy.

Devo Max, where Scotland can keep it's own income and raise it's own taxes.

So why on earth would we want to do that when it would mean an end to the BILLIONS of subsidies we get from England and cost us 15p on the pound in ADDITIONAL income taxes?

Are you Nats all masochists?

skintmacflint

Generali wrote: »

Salmond has been accused of anti-English racism in the past:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scotland/scottish-politics/9632629/Police-asked-to-investigate-Alex-Salmonds-anti-English-jibes.html

http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/steerpike/2013/09/alex-salmonds-selective-history-lesson/

Not sure if he is anti English, or it's just that in his mind the bulk of Conservative voters live in the South now, which isn't quite accurate. He's certainly by his own admission anti establishment, anti Westminster , anti authority. Except his own authority, naturally.

Couple of quotes from earlier years. Exact spoken words from BBC documentary Alex Salmond A Rebels Journey.

1987 -
' our objective is to break the present power of English Toryism over the Scottish people in the next parliament , that's what we intend to do'

1990
' the Labour leadership may win the Yuppie votes in the South , but we're going to win the battle for the hearts and minds of the Scottish people.
'

kabayiri

Shakethedisease wrote: »

No you're alright, I wasn't assuming a hidden agenda.

I think everyone would like to see more spending on the NHS wherever they are in the UK. I guess though, people have differing ideas of where priorities should lie in terms of 'important' treatments etc etc. It's very easy to overspend.

The Scottish NHS has many failings, but at the moment is doing no worse than anywhere else in the UK. And Wales certainly seems to be coming off worst in terms of waiting times and overall satisfaction levels.

Tax, well I wouldn't mind paying a bit more. However, there is an issue in that I already pay tax.. and it goes in full to the Treasury. Imo, more tax, even if it went specifically towards the Scottish NHS, would produce a distinct feeling that raising taxes Scotland wide ( with limited powers and only through income tax ).. would in effect be paying twice for the same service ?

I think they'd have to come up with a means of demonstrating how additional 'Scottish only' taxes would produce real measurable results, in 'important' areas, very quickly ! Of course, those areas to deem important would be endlessly discussed and debated. For example, there are lots that would like to see additional taxes towards Cancer care, or special baby care units ( treatments/research)... but this would be against areas that are already underfunded or where private healthcare might not be at acceptable levels. Like mental healthcare ( understaffed/student training ) and elderly social care community systems ( understaffed/woeful pay/bed blocking etc ).

A bit of a minefield all round.

I'd accept the 'being taxed twice' argument more readily if each region were already paying it's way.

However, we are not. We all know we are overspending by approx £100bn pa.

You wouldn't be paying twice; just raising additional revenue.

I don't think everyone wants to see more spending on the NHS. I don't because it worries me that it starts to look like a bottomless pit.

I have also seen firsthand just how profligate the IT spend has become in the NHS.

That is just me though, and I would abide by the collective view for my region.

It strikes me that this ability to raise additional money through a local tax gives Scotland a way to demonstrate they can run a successful economy with a different priority set to the rest of the UK.

You have the opportunity here to lead by example.

Leanne1812

N1AK wrote: »

So you can't quote me for using double standards, or for ridiculing Alex Salmond after accusing me of both, but I'm the one who is mistaken and deflecting...

Well you've definitely persuaded me that I should waste my time finding quotes for you, when it's readily apparent you'll dismiss it on some spurious grounds just like you're trying to do with your false accusations.

Once again, it's not all about you.......I'm talking generally about double standards & ridicule. If you happened to see Nicola Sturgeon in The Sun this week you might well agree with me ( on the ridicule front) just so we are clear.

I'm really not looking to pick a fight with you. All I did was ask to see evidence of these odious remarks.

I notice Generali has posted 2 links one of which I have dismissed and the other I'd define as anti westminster not english. Do you disagree?

Generali

Leanne1812 wrote: »

Once again, it's not all about you.......I'm talking generally about double standards & ridicule. If you happened to see Nicola Sturgeon in The Sun this week you might well agree with me ( on the ridicule front) just so we are clear.

I'm really not looking to pick a fight with you. All I did was ask to see evidence of these odious remarks.

I notice Generali has posted 2 links one of which I have dismissed and the other I'd define as anti westminster not english. Do you disagree?

What The Sun did to Nicola Sturgeon is what The Sun quite rightly does to politicians. Thankfully in Britain there is a long and ribald tradition of treating politicians with the respect they deserve. From Hogarth to Steve Bell via Spitting Image politicians get portrayed horribly.

If we start treating politicians respectfully they'll get delusions of adequacy.

Leanne1812

Generali wrote: »

What The Sun did to Nicola Sturgeon is what The Sun quite rightly does to politicians. Thankfully in Britain there is a long and ribald tradition of treating politicians with the respect they deserve. From Hogarth to Steve Bell via Spitting Image politicians get portrayed horribly.

If we start treating politicians respectfully they'll get delusions of adequacy.

I'd agree if it was right across the spectrum but it's not is it?

You'll also note it was only the English edition of The Sun who published the picture & article. Wonder why it wasn't UK wide? A wee bit of stoking possibly......

Generali

Leanne1812 wrote: »

I'd agree if it was right across the spectrum but it's not is it?

Yeah it is right across the spectrum. Male/female, white/black, Right/Left wing. Someone somewhere will be prepared to draw or create a horrible picture of you if you're a politician and hooray for them.

You just don't like it because it was an SNP pollie who was being lampooned. You love it when it's Unionists getting their just deserts I'm sure.

.string.

Shakethedisease wrote:

I wasn't. I was giving an overall view of the Tory agenda, stirring up anti-SNP/Scottish feeling in order to win votes.

You are wrong on a couple of counts, at least, there.

It's not to do with SNP/Scots - it's just the SNP.

It's not stirring up - people are already "stirred up" about the prospect of having saboteurs in Government.