the unfair child tax credit system

GirlFromMars_2

fellwalker09 wrote: »

And, please can anyone point out what I'm missing here - it's clearly a satisfactory rule for a college student's parent to qualify for ctc until that student is 20, but not for a student doing a degree. I don't see the difference?

I'm guessing he had the benefits check up before you knew about the degree course.

As he is claiming DLA he will be entitled to apply for ESA Income Related while he is a University Student.

If he were leaving college and not going to Uni he would also be entitled to claim ESA-IR.

It is only while he is still in college that he is considered a child, once he leaves secondary education he will be an adult and will be able to claim benefits in his own right.

Hopefully this helps ease your mind about what will be happening. I'm surprised given his age that they didn't think what would happen after secondary education ended in his benefits check up!

Good luck with the future, I hope he enjoys his new course!

fellwalker09

Sorry Shiloe but no. I can understand the difference between the level of education naturally but not for the ctc ruling. Never mind. It is what it is.
As for full or part time, my son is naturally going down the part time route -fulltime degree would be too much work for him.
ESA -the rules look 'tricky' -I read up about this recently and thought it said that you were awarded this for 13 weeks only. Then I recall something about proving your work ability etc -an assessment. My son won't want to go down that route -having to trudge to the employment centre wherever it is. Plus he's already been told he does not qualify.
We had an assessment last year for direct payments -he gets 2 hours of care per week. I guess we can ask for another assessment.
ESA would be ok as long as he does not have to keep going down to the employment centre -it's a big upheaval for him believe it or not. He's severely disabled. I will contact his social worker and have a chat. Thank you all for your replies.

GirlFromMars_2

I think you are misunderstanding what Employment and Support Allowance is, which is understandable given it's doublespeak name.

ESA is the benefit for adults who are unable to work due to illness or disability.

There are complicated rules for who is entitled, and you should look at the ESA descriptors to see which apply to your son.

ESA starts as a 13 week assessment phase. In theory this actually lasts longer, as it's very unusual to be assessed within this period, the main phase will be backdated to the end of the assessment period though after he is put into the main phase.

The main phase has two different groups, the Work Related Activity Group and the Support group. People in the Work Related Activity Group may be expected to complete activities that will help them into the work place including attending work focused interviews at the Job Centre. People in the Support Group don't have to do any work related activity.

I think you need to see a benefits advisor and get help with applying for your sons ESA.

callum9999

fellwalker09 wrote: »

Sorry Shiloe but no. I can understand the difference between the level of education naturally but not for the ctc ruling. Never mind. It is what it is.
As for full or part time, my son is naturally going down the part time route -fulltime degree would be too much work for him.
ESA -the rules look 'tricky' -I read up about this recently and thought it said that you were awarded this for 13 weeks only. Then I recall something about proving your work ability etc -an assessment. My son won't want to go down that route -having to trudge to the employment centre wherever it is. Plus he's already been told he does not qualify.
We had an assessment last year for direct payments -he gets 2 hours of care per week. I guess we can ask for another assessment.
ESA would be ok as long as he does not have to keep going down to the employment centre -it's a big upheaval for him believe it or not. He's severely disabled. I will contact his social worker and have a chat. Thank you all for your replies.

If you understand the difference between the level of education, why do you not understand the tax credit bit? Over simplistically - college is for children, university is for adults. If you're an adult undertaking adult education there is no logical reason to still get child benefits.

Look into the disabled student allowance too.

nannytone_2

BY ALL MEANS XHAT TO HIS SOCIAL WORKER ... JUST REMEMBER THAT THEY ARE NOT EXPERT IN BENEFIT ENTITLEMENT, EVEN THOUGH MANY LIKE TO THINK THEY ARE!
THE 13 WEEK PERIOD IS THE ASSESSMENT PHASE.
AFTER WHICH TIME ( THOUGH YOU CAN WAIT A LOT LONGGER THAN THE 13 WEEKS) YOU EITHER HAVE AN ASSESSMENT, OR SOME PEOPLE GET PLACED INTO A GROUP BASED ON THE INFORMATION THEY PROVIDED.
IF PLACED IN THE WORK RELATED GROUP ( FONT PANIC... THEY ARENT EXPECTED TO WORK) THEY MAY BE ASKED TO ATTEND THE JOB CENTRE PERIODICALLY. IN THE SUPPORT GROUP THIS DOESNT HAPPEN.
I DO UNDERSTAND THAT YOUR SONE DOESNT LIKE THIS.... BUT I'M AFRAID THAT IF HE NEEDS TO CLAIM BENEFIT, THEN HE HAS TO JUMP THROUGH THE SAME HOOPS AS EVERYONE ELSE.
HE WILL ALSO HAVE a PIP assessment at some point in the near future

fellwalker09

callum9999 wrote: »

If you understand the difference between the level of education, why do you not understand the tax credit bit? Over simplistically - college is for children, university is for adults. If you're an adult undertaking adult education there is no logical reason to still get child benefits.

Of course I see the difference. But let's turn this around. I also see that adults attend college - and for information purposes, college is not just for those who did not do so well at school, as was suggested by someone earlier. It's a decision some successful students take and they also offer degree study.
But the scenario is that someone of the age 18 and 19 attending college can qualify for ctc up to age 20, pending on study options. These people are no longer children. They are adults. The argument/rule does not stand up. Basically, it's tough luck for us and many like us (I know) but it's a rule to save dwp money.(cynical I know) Well, that's all right for many people, but it is difficult enough being a carer, having sacrificed my own salary. And one can never call dla a lot of money. Yes we do have care costs -there are so many services/equipment/beneficial therapies for disabled people that the NHS/social services simply can't pay for. That's natural -you've seen the state of the NHS? There's a lot that can be accessed of help but you have to pay - and anyone with any knowledge of disability will tell you that such things for disabled come at one heck of a cost. For instance, this is going back some years. My son's britax car seat, bought in 1997 roughly when he outgrew the baby one, was around £40 then. However, his physio said it wasn't good enough or safe enough and we ought to buy the special needs one. Only britax made this and it cost us £400 back in 1998. That's one 'mild' example. Footwear is another one. He has to have this specially made of put up with wearing basic, horrid looking 'uncool' shoes from the NHS (he's allowed 1 pair/year). Cost of having shoes made is rather expensive. Specialist clothing is also another requirement -certainly trousers. They cost £50 minimum per pair. That's expensive to me but probably not to some who buy designer labels. It all adds up. He uses his dla for fuel costs also -I have to drive. We have a motability car, wheelchair access otherwise he can't get out. So we forfeit this part of the dla in order to have the transport. He's very lucky to have that. But he can't drive. These are just a few of the examples.
Care is very difficult -it's always been an issue because he needs help with all daily living skills, including bathroom. And it's this one where he opposes having help from a carer. I don't blame him. Apart from his physical difficulties he's just a typical young man. No learning disability or speech probs etc. But I'm rambling now.

xylophone

http://www.disabilityrightsuk.org/employment-and-support-allowance-overview

See section 16 "students"

Shiloe

fellwalker09 wrote: »

But the scenario is that someone of the age 18 and 19 attending college can qualify for ctc up to age 20, pending on study options. These people are no longer children. They are adults. The argument/rule does not stand up. Basically, it's tough luck for us and many like us (I know) but it's a rule to save dwp money.(cynical I know)

But why would you want your grown up child (who you have admitted is an adult) to be awarded children's benefits. He is clearly trying to establish some independence for himself and you want to take away from that by still having him qualify for £60ish a week!

By the sounds of things their are many different benefits being paid into your household the issue you have is they are no longer going into your pocket but your Son's. You can't have it both ways.

You are being cynical in your saving money comment as if that was the case the cut off across the board would be on their 18th birthday with no special rules - that would save them even more money! Even they can see what me and the other posters have been trying to get across to you as to why the CTC rules are indeed FAIR.

It is your view that is clouded with greed not the governments.

xylophone

Apart from his physical difficulties he's just a typical young man. No learning disability or speech probs etc

Then he will understand the rules concerning ESA etc?

He will want to be as independent as possible?

Cost of having shoes made is rather expensive. Specialist clothing is also another requirement -certainly trousers. They cost £50 minimum per pair.

He'll be needing to learn budgeting skills?

Care is very difficult -it's always been an issue because he needs help with all daily living skills, including bathroom. And it's this one where he opposes having help from a carer. I don't blame him.

But what will happen when you are no longer fit enough to assist him?

Blackpool_Saver

You need to see a disability benefits welfare rights worker, not a social worker, and you need to lose the attitude towards people who are trying to help you.
This is coming from another carer by the way, my son is in a similar position, he doesn't have cerebral palsy but he does claim esa and he is going to be doing a degree. At some point you have to let go a bit, I know it is hard but you have to let him either claim/study or work in his own right, and in his own name. He can then contribute to the household which will be good for his self esteem.