Landlord saying we stole items

bbk87

Hi all, i'm new here and need a tad advice on behalf of my mother.

My mother rented her property through someone she knows. There was no agency involved. The landlord issued a S21 and the council has helped re-house her. She moved a handful of days ago within the timeframe of the S21.

The previous landlord is saying that my mum has stolen items from the property. I am unsure what they mean by this, as the property was unfurnished, bar from a few pots and pans, which are still at the property now. My mum replaced the washing machine that was in the property as it didn't work, but she left the new one and the old one there. She also left a freezer there, that wasn't there in the first place.

The tenancy agreement states that the property is rented with all it's fixtures, furnishing and fittings that are detailed on the attached inventory, but an inventory was never carried out at the property.

The landlord is saying she's going to the police - can anyone offer any advice?

fishpond

No signed inventory.
Assuming the above is correct, the LL hasn't got a leg to stand on.

theartfullodger

If he repeats his allegation mum should report him to Police for harassment.

Was a deposit paid & if so protected within 30 days of payment?

pmlindyloo

bbk87 wrote: »

Hi all, i'm new here and need a tad advice on behalf of my mother.

My mother rented her property through someone she knows. There was no agency involved. The landlord issued a S21 and the council has helped re-house her. She moved a handful of days ago within the timeframe of the S21.

The previous landlord is saying that my mum has stolen items from the property. I am unsure what they mean by this, as the property was unfurnished, bar from a few pots and pans, which are still at the property now. My mum replaced the washing machine that was in the property as it didn't work, but she left the new one and the old one there. She also left a freezer there, that wasn't there in the first place.

The tenancy agreement states that the property is rented with all it's fixtures, furnishing and fittings that are detailed on the attached inventory, but an inventory was never carried out at the property.

The landlord is saying she's going to the police - can anyone offer any advice?

The first thing to do is ask the landlord to which items they are referring. Also ask for a copy of the signed inventory which describes them.

That should do it.

ampersand

theartfullodger wrote: »

If he repeats his allegation mum should report him...... for harassment.
#
.....and slander.

bbk87

I have emailed the landlord asking which items they are referring to, and have also noted to them that an inventory didn't take place.

Regarding a deposit, it is unclear whether one was paid or not. Mum is disabled and has memory problems, she says she thinks she paid one in cash but can't remember. She can't find a receipt that was in with the tenancy stuff. However the tenancy says that a deposit was paid, so I'm unsure.

princeofpounds

I know it's hard but she should try not to worry. There are two issues here:

1) criminal accusation of theft. This would need to be proved beyond all reasonable doubt. This is impossible; there is no evidence of what was in the property, let alone what was taken. The police will likely not even entertain any involvement in this situation. If they do, they will quickly realise it is nonsense. But I reckon it is 98% likely they will say 'civil matter' and ignore it.

2) civil liability for missing items. This has a lower standard of proof, in that it should be on the balance of probability. But we know very well what evidence is required, and a proper inventory is necessary. Plus your mother has evidence in the tenancy agreement that she paid a deposit in advance of entry, and if this was not protected the landlord can be counter-sued for 1-3x penalty, which you would win.

So this will probably not go anywhere at all. But you have to deal with the process step by step until it dies away.

Do not get involved in any drawn out conversations over this. I would write a simple letter (paper trails are everything) to request what items the LL believes are missing and the evidence behind that claim, stating that making false accusations is a serious matter that would be contested vigorously, and, if the deposit was not protected (your mother can contact the three scheme operators to confirm), point out that you may pursue that matter further.

Then just wait. Probably nothing will happen.

Up to you how polite you want to be in your first letter requesting more info, vs. firing back.

bbk87

princeofpounds wrote: »

I know it's hard but she should try not to worry. There are two issues here:

1) criminal accusation of theft. This would need to be proved beyond all reasonable doubt. This is impossible; there is no evidence of what was in the property, let alone what was taken. The police will likely not even entertain any involvement in this situation. If they do, they will quickly realise it is nonsense. But I reckon it is 98% likely they will say 'civil matter' and ignore it.

2) civil liability for missing items. This has a lower standard of proof, in that it should be on the balance of probability. But we know very well what evidence is required, and a proper inventory is necessary. Plus your mother has evidence in the tenancy agreement that she paid a deposit in advance of entry, and if this was not protected the landlord can be counter-sued for 1-3x penalty, which you would win.

So this will probably not go anywhere at all. But you have to deal with the process step by step until it dies away.

Do not get involved in any drawn out conversations over this. I would write a simple letter (paper trails are everything) to request what items the LL believes are missing and the evidence behind that claim, stating that making false accusations is a serious matter that would be contested vigorously, and, if the deposit was not protected (your mother can contact the three scheme operators to confirm), point out that you may pursue that matter further.

Then just wait. Probably nothing will happen.

Up to you how polite you want to be in your first letter requesting more info, vs. firing back.

Thanks for that, very helpful info

I emailed the landlord and asked him what items he was referring to, and he said that my mum was a thief and a benefit fraudster apparently, and that he is going to the police and the benefit department. That was that.

The tenancy states £900 rent, but the landlord (because landlord is mums ex boyfriends sister) said only £800 rent, then she asked for £850 second year. We have a text that says she wanted full rent from the new tenancy agreement, but they didn't give another agreement anyway. Mums worried her benefit will now be stopped, as the council re-housed her after the landlord issued s.21.

princeofpounds

The benefits thing is far more worrisome to me. Has your mother been overclaiming or something? And/or underpaying? Why on earth would she sign an agreement with a fictitious rental amount?

bbk87

princeofpounds wrote: »

The benefits thing is far more worrisome to me. Has your mother been overclaiming or something? And/or underpaying? Why on earth would she sign an agreement with a fictitious rental amount?

They signed the agreement, then the landlord said to pay just £800 as that is all she got from the housing benefit department. Plus the landlord was my mums boyfriends sister at the time. This has all happened since my mum got rid of her boyfriend.

The landlord upped the rent to £850 the following year and my mum paid £50 a month top up herself.

Marktheshark

I would ask the police to come and see mum and then go round and issue a Harassment warning to this Landlord.
They want police, give them police.