Distance selling regulations question (don’t shop with Big Shoe Direct)

spud098

Hello,

Would appreciate a bit of advice on this one... it's regarding the problem of who should pay for outgoing postage when an online order is cancelled, I thought I knew the rules but I've never had to fight my corner before...

I thought at the time that I might live to regret it, but I bought some shoes from a small online retailer (bigsize.co.uk for big size shoes) for my husband's birthday as the usual shoe shops just didn't have the size I needed. I ordered the size 14's, but when he tried them on they were a bit too large. It was only 3 days since I received them, so I immediately emailed the store and said they were nice shoes but a bit too big, I was going to order the size 13 as a separate order and I would like to return the size 14's for a full refund. Then I made a brand new order for the size 13's.

We received the size 13's and they were fine very happy, but when I later looked through my credit card statement I noticed that Big Shoe Direct had made a random additional charge on my card of £5.50.

The shoes cost £50, so in total I was expecting to pay £50 for the size 14's plus £5.50 postage, -£55.50 refund for the size 14's, then £55.50 for the size 13's = £55.50 (plus my own postage to myhermes to return the size 13's)

But actually I'd been charged £55.50 + £5.50 = £61

So I've basically I’ve paid over £16 for 3 way postage for a pair of shoes : (

When I emailed Big Size Shoes (politely saying I’d cancelled the order according to the distance selling regulations and querying the extra charge), this is the guys response:

...
"If you had cancelled the Order, you would not have received the Goods. And would have been refunded in full. So not really sure where you are going with this, we are not EBAY. Our Full Trading Terms and Conditions are clearly set out on the website as a legal requirement.
There is no breach here.

I`m sorry you feel you should be refunded £5.50 postage costs. But like I say we have to pay to send them out to you.
And in many cases we actually make a loss, as we part subsidise the delivery charges to keep costs down.
That can be the draw back with Mail Order as opposed to going into a shop and trying them on.
Companies that offer Free Postage, customers will often pay more for the goods, as the postage element is included in the price.
We do not offer this as a vast majority of our loyal customers buy from our shop, so therefore they would be paying more for the goods also, which is not really fair in my opinion."

As you can imagine I'm a bit miffed at this - surely this guy knows about the distance selling regulations? Is he just having me on?

Also I have no idea where to go next with this one... I have all the emails of the orders and my cancellation and the courier paper trails for the shoes in both directions - but how do I go about actually getting my money back? Do I really have to take him to the small claims court? How much will it cost me? never done it before :{ And then I'm doubting myself, thinking have I actually got this right, am I really entitled to that £5.50 back?

If anyone could give me some advice / thoughts / anything it would be so much appreciated, I just feel pretty rubbish here like I'm being conned

In the meantime I completely recommend against shopping with Big Shoe Direct bigsize.co.uk

Thanks in advance for any help
nicola

Ectophile

The Distance Selling Regulations have now been cancelled and replaced by the Consumer Contracts Regulations 2013.

frugal_mike

The Distance Selling Regulations were superseded by The Consumer Contracts Regulations in June this year. But both the old and new regulations are clear that where a refund is due that refund includes any postage costs from the seller to the consumer. The only exception to this is if the consumer selects a delivery option that is more expensive than standard delivery, such as next-day delivery. In this case the seller only has to refund the standard delivery cost.

It really doesn't matter what the seller thinks is fair, or indeed what the terms and conditions are for their website. Their contract with you states that you are owed the full refund, including delivery costs (unless you picked a more expensive delivery, in which case you only get part of the delivery costs as mentioned above).

The above assumes that this is a UK company subject to UK law, which it sounds like it is.

frugal_mike

hollydays wrote: »

Small onlline retailer.
If they have specified return costs.. 5.50 does NOT Seem excessive..
You can't expect them to return for free!! It's totally irrelevant to try to get sympathy , oh has bigbsizes..

Why the hell do,you,expect to return them for free !
! How about you travel and find.. Blah. Blah..

Do shop with this company. .. Damn customers who expect a freebie!!!

The shop are not charging for the return, OP states they arranged their own courier. The shop is refusing to refund the outbound postage cost.

spud098

Hollydays thanks for your response, but I thought the DSR (OK now Consumer Contracts Regulations 2013) entitled me to my outgoing postage to be refunded too if I cancelled promptly - I know it seems odd, but isn't that just the law, to help the online selling world go round?

To quote from
w(w)w.tradingstandards.gov.uk/cgi-bin/glos/bus1item.cgi?file=*badv710-1001.txt

"EFFECTS OF WITHDRAWAL OR CANCELLATION
If a consumer withdraws from a contract or exercises their right to cancel, both your and their obligations under the contract are ended. In addition you must reimburse the consumer all that he has paid you, including any original delivery costs (you cannot charge any cancellation fees). "

What am I missing here?
Genuinely thank you for correcting me here if I am wrong... (but please be nice I'm new at this!)

Thanks, nicola

frugal_mike

hollydays wrote: »

Do post in context and approprietly

Me post in context? I did. I answered the OPs question, about outbound postage. Not about return postage, that they paid My Hermes for.

gik

hollydays wrote: »

Are we saying the retailer, should return for free because the op,chose the wrong size?

Slow down and stop editing and deleting your typos please?

spud098

I paid myhermes to post the wrong size shoes back - we're just talking about the £5.50 initial outgoing postage charge, which I paid as part of the initial purchase and I thought would be refunded according to the regulations. I know its a small amount of money but it's christmas and I'm counting the pennies : {

wealdroam

frugal_mike wrote: »

The above assumes that this is a UK company subject to UK law, which it sounds like it is.

Yes it is a UK company.

On their website, a page called Info, it says:

RETURNS.

Should you need to return anything, you may do so within 14 days of receipt of goods for an exchange or refund. The goods must be unworn and in its original packing / box. ( This does not affect your statutory rights ) We are not liable for any returns postage / delivery costs. We do not refund the costs of sending / despatch of the goods out, as we partly subsidise this anyway. Customers are liable for the cost of posting / despatch and any returns costs. It is recommended to obtain a proof of posting / receipt if returning goods back to us.

OP, you should bring that to the attention of Trading Standards... via the CAB Consumer helpline: 03454 04 05 06

frugal_mike

hollydays wrote: »

Are we saying the retailer, should return for free because the op,chose the wrong size?

From Regulation 34 of the CCRs (bolding is mine)

34.!!(1)!!The trader must reimburse all payments, other than payments for delivery, received from the consumer, subject to paragraph (10).

(2)!The trader must reimburse any payment for delivery received from the consumer, unless the consumer expressly chose a kind of delivery costing more than the least expensive common and generally acceptable kind of delivery offered by the trader.

(3)!In that case, the trader must reimburse any payment for delivery received from the consumer up to the amount the consumer would have paid if the consumer had chosen the least expensive common and generally acceptable kind of delivery offered by the trader.

The retailer must honour the contract they entered into, which includes those terms. Those terms cannot be contracted out.

spud098

It was just the standard delivery charge that I paid. So if I am entitled to it back, any advice on how I can get him to refund me? : }