Uniform Costs and the Minimum Wage

callum9999

Hi,

I've been looking online about whether employers insisting you buy your own uniform must factor that into whether their wages meet the minimum wage laws or not but it seems a little vague to me.

Various websites (including .gov) make it clear that if they deduct uniform costs from your wages then it can't make your average hourly rate fall below the minimum, but they're less clear about employers who give you the option to buy it out of your own pocket. Does anyone know if they have to or not?

Thanks.

Another_not_new_user

If you have the option, then it is a choice, and the NMW does not enter into it UNLESS the uniform is specifically branded to your workplace and has no "real life use". So if they are saying (for example) that your uniform is black shoes, black trousers and a white shirt, you may buy those things for yourself, or take loan from the employer and pay that loan back. And use those items when you wish. If it's hoodie with "Col. Saunders makes the best chicken" - they should pay for that.


Which is all pretty much moot, as you obviously haven't started the job yet and TWO YEARS is the point at which you get unfair dismissal rights.

callum9999

Another_not_new_user wrote: »

If you have the option, then it is a choice, and the NMW does not enter into it UNLESS the uniform is specifically branded to your workplace and has no "real life use". So if they are saying (for example) that your uniform is black shoes, black trousers and a white shirt, you may buy those things for yourself, or take loan from the employer and pay that loan back. And use those items when you wish. If it's hoodie with "Col. Saunders makes the best chicken" - they should pay for that.


Which is all pretty much moot, as you obviously haven't started the job yet and TWO YEARS is the point at which you get unfair dismissal rights.

Thanks but not what I wanted to hear! The suit certainly could have a use outside of work, not that I would ever wear it (hence why I don't own them now!).

Though as I would not be happy working for below minimum wage whether it's legally allowable or not, I wouldn't be overly concerned if they try and dismiss me for making a fuss over it. Now I know the law's not on my side there isn't much I can do anyway, but if it was and they sacked me over it then I think the bad publicity (they are incredibly well known and trade off a reputation for treating their staff particularly well) would outweigh the rather small cost of increasing the pay to a sufficient level - not least due to it only being a 6 week contract.

getmore4less

For a 6 week contract needing clothes you don't have and won't normally wear.

charity shop.

Takeaway_Addict

callum9999 wrote: »

Thanks but not what I wanted to hear! The suit certainly could have a use outside of work, not that I would ever wear it (hence why I don't own them now!).

Though as I would not be happy working for below minimum wage whether it's legally allowable or not, I wouldn't be overly concerned if they try and dismiss me for making a fuss over it. Now I know the law's not on my side there isn't much I can do anyway, but if it was and they sacked me over it then I think the bad publicity (they are incredibly well known and trade off a reputation for treating their staff particularly well) would outweigh the rather small cost of increasing the pay to a sufficient level - not least due to it only being a 6 week contract.

The papers won't care so blackmailing them won't work...

anamenottaken

Another_not_new_user wrote: »

If you have the option, then it is a choice, and the NMW does not enter into it UNLESS the uniform is specifically branded to your workplace and has no "real life use". So if they are saying (for example) that your uniform is black shoes, black trousers and a white shirt, you may buy those things for yourself, or take loan from the employer and pay that loan back. And use those items when you wish. If it's hoodie with "Col. Saunders makes the best chicken" - they should pay for that.


Which is all pretty much moot, as you obviously haven't started the job yet and TWO YEARS is the point at which you get unfair dismissal rights.

But . . . there is no qualifying period for claiming unfair dismissal arising from an employee seeking to exercise a statutory right (in this case the right to NMW).

But . . . proving a dismissal was on those grounds may be difficult.


ETA: Of course we have since learned that "the suit" is not "a uniform" and, for the OP's situation, this has no bearing on NMW.

stevemLS

If it is just a "suit" then it is not a uniform.

HappyMJ

callum9999 wrote: »

Thanks but not what I wanted to hear! The suit certainly could have a use outside of work, not that I would ever wear it (hence why I don't own them now!).

Though as I would not be happy working for below minimum wage whether it's legally allowable or not, I wouldn't be overly concerned if they try and dismiss me for making a fuss over it. Now I know the law's not on my side there isn't much I can do anyway, but if it was and they sacked me over it then I think the bad publicity (they are incredibly well known and trade off a reputation for treating their staff particularly well) would outweigh the rather small cost of increasing the pay to a sufficient level - not least due to it only being a 6 week contract.

If the job isn't worth taking then don't take the job. It's your choice.

callum9999

HappyMJ wrote: »

If the job isn't worth taking then don't take the job. It's your choice.

Thanks, and apologies if you didn't mean that in a snarky way, but I was more than capable of coming up with that option on my own...

Takeaway_Addict wrote: »

The papers won't care so blackmailing them won't work...

I don't recall using the word blackmail, or mentioning the papers... If my right to earn the minimum wage was being violated by such a prestigious firm and they dismissed me because of it then I would have pursued them to the full extent of the law. My right has not been violated so I won't.

Nada666

That is not a uniform. That is clothing. You cannot be reimbursed for clothing.

If you choose to only buy clothing that would not pass muster for work that is your choice - but it means extra expense for when you work. It also means you would not be able to claim means tested benefits such as JSA between jobs.

What sort of person does not own suitable clothing in the first place? The extra cost of dry cleaning over washing - that's a bother but just one of the many costs of employment (travel, lunches, haircuts, toothpaste.)

Another_not_new_user

I think it needs to be very clear - the employer IS NOT paying less than the minimum wage. They ARE paying the minimum wage.


They have a "dress code" for work, and employees are expected to attend work dressed appropriately. The employer is prepared to LOAN employees the money to buy appropriate dress if they do not have it or choose not to spend money they already have on it. Since this is a loan employees are expected to pay the loan back. Repaying a loan is NOT taking the wage below the NMW. You are being paid the NMW and agreeing to repay a loan by deductions. Which is no more illegal than you paying your rent, credit card or electricity bill out of a NMW.


So nobody is violating your right to earn the national minimum wage. There is no case. The full extent of the law would extend to signing on at the Job Centre and explaining to them why you refused work. Unless you have another job to go to or don't need a job, in which case this is all moot.