Was a full-time student and on JSA

Viberduo

callum9999 wrote: »

Which university are you referring to? Unless it's some kind of fly-by-night place, I can't believe that they wouldn't include private study as an integral part of the course. Whether you choose to do it or not is utterly irrelevant - otherwise you could just claim you don't go to half your lectures...

The fact your local council may use a different definition of full or part time is irrelevant.

I just remember I got confused there, it was 3 different unis, 1 I went to aged 19 which is when I had benefit stopped, other 2 were later and one of them was where I met my friend, I also started a college course in current town a few months ago but left due to not being able to get funding and when I contacted council to get exemption I was told I had to be doing at least 20 hours, when I said I think the course was about 16 hours in class I was told it wouldnt be elligable, theres a difference between what you do in your free time and what you are required to do(even if you dont do it)

And your bit at the end is totally incorrect, the difference is you are timetabled for X amount of hours, what you do in your spare time isnt class time so if you dont turn up for lectures you are still timetabled for them.

Establishments themselves even list something like 16 hours a week lecture time.

tomtontom

Viberduo your understanding is all over the place. The DWP guidance is clear, for university level study you are classed as full time if you do more than 21 hours of study, tuition or work experience.

plecka, I think your worries are unfounded. You are eligible to claim JSA from your course end date (your university will be able to tell you when this is), not your graduation date.

callum9999

Viberduo wrote: »

I just remember I got confused there, it was 3 different unis, 1 I went to aged 19 which is when I had benefit stopped, other 2 were later and one of them was where I met my friend, I also started a college course in current town a few months ago but left due to not being able to get funding and when I contacted council to get exemption I was told I had to be doing at least 20 hours, when I said I think the course was about 16 hours in class I was told it wouldnt be elligable, theres a difference between what you do in your free time and what you are required to do(even if you dont do it)

And your bit at the end is totally incorrect, the difference is you are timetabled for X amount of hours, what you do in your spare time isnt class time so if you dont turn up for lectures you are still timetabled for them.

Establishments themselves even list something like 16 hours a week lecture time.

So you're refusing to give me the names of those universities then? If you don't then I can only assume that they follow the same guide virtually every other university in the country does - X amount of hours in class and X amount of hours privately.

Nothing you've described makes me think anything I've said is wrong. All time outside of class is NOT spare time, X amount of hours are university mandated study times.

Viberduo

tomtontom wrote: »

Viberduo your understanding is all over the place. The DWP guidance is clear, for university level study you are classed as full time if you do more than 21 hours of study, tuition or work experience.

plecka, I think your worries are unfounded. You are eligible to claim JSA from your course end date (your university will be able to tell you when this is), not your graduation date.

My point is the university has set hours for lectures, so if I did 6 hours in class that doesnt mean you do 15 hours of study its just you can if you want, when I had my money stopped they claimed like 40 hours a week study was required for my 2 x 3 hour lecturers in the 1st year of study of a basic course therefore they claimed my 40 hours study would make me a full time student so I would be paid a full time loan.

The argument is on if you do not study or you only study a few hours a week but the lecturers recommend more it will be counted as becoming full time, they had no issue with me for months before claiming I was full time(though in reality it was I stood up to my advisor on many occasions as they claimed I was lying when I said I had 4 buses a day to parents, parents couldnt give me a lift, I didnt get on with neighbours so couldnt get a lift from them) I know other people who went part time with no issues.

Why would they call it part time study if every module wanted like 10-20 hours a week study therefore making it over 21 hours therefore full time? If so why can't I go to the council and say I am studying 20 hours a week at home therefore full time so should get CT exemption?

ViolaLass

Again, I ask, why would your employer care?

callum9999

Viberduo wrote: »

My point is the university has set hours for lectures, so if I did 6 hours in class that doesnt mean you do 15 hours of study its just you can if you want, when I had my money stopped they claimed like 40 hours a week study was required for my 2 x 3 hour lecturers in the 1st year of study of a basic course therefore they claimed my 40 hours study would make me a full time student so I would be paid a full time loan.

The argument is on if you do not study or you only study a few hours a week but the lecturers recommend more it will be counted as becoming full time, they had no issue with me for months before claiming I was full time(though in reality it was I stood up to my advisor on many occasions as they claimed I was lying when I said I had 4 buses a day to parents, parents couldnt give me a lift, I didnt get on with neighbours so couldnt get a lift from them) I know other people who went part time with no issues.

Why would they call it part time study if every module wanted like 10-20 hours a week study therefore making it over 21 hours therefore full time? If so why can't I go to the council and say I am studying 20 hours a week at home therefore full time so should get CT exemption?

Then you should have gotten your university to give you a letter confirming you are in full-time education. Required study hours do count - I am not debating that matter any more. If they didn't then the majority of third and fourth year students, as well as many in certain subjects for their entire course, would be classed as part-time.

Viberduo

callum9999 wrote: »

Then you should have gotten your university to give you a letter confirming you are in full-time education. Required study hours do count - I am not debating that matter any more. If they didn't then the majority of third and fourth year students, as well as many in certain subjects for their entire course, would be classed as part-time.

I did as that was the university policy, council wanted a form of their own filled in by my department and accepted nothing else, their reasoning was that I could drop out of uni and just keep the letter saying I was exempt.

I am more saying that its less the outside study that matters but how its seen, I did 2 courses at 2 different unis full time and they each were like 12 or 16 hours (Depending on 1st or 2nd semester) but the 4 or 8 hours to make it up to 20 was timetabled as "self focused study" So if it was a case of just adding assumed study time to make it full time then it wouldnt be on the timetables as people can just claim they were full time.

If study time is counted it should be on the mininal sense, not like when they decided I do 40 hours a week study for a 6 hour a week course, 5 hours a week max would be my idea because logically it would make 16 hours a week, full time is 3 modules a term so that would be 24 hours a week on average.

But it is how I was treated each time so I could not of been given the same information each time by the dwp, also would not explain how I know people who are part time at uni doing 6 hours a week in class could claim benefits and be classed as part time.

t0rt0ise

The HR department is not going to care what you were claiming when. All they are interested in is that you got the qualification.

callum9999

Viberduo wrote: »

I did as that was the university policy, council wanted a form of their own filled in by my department and accepted nothing else, their reasoning was that I could drop out of uni and just keep the letter saying I was exempt.

I am more saying that its less the outside study that matters but how its seen, I did 2 courses at 2 different unis full time and they each were like 12 or 16 hours (Depending on 1st or 2nd semester) but the 4 or 8 hours to make it up to 20 was timetabled as "self focused study" So if it was a case of just adding assumed study time to make it full time then it wouldnt be on the timetables as people can just claim they were full time.

If study time is counted it should be on the mininal sense, not like when they decided I do 40 hours a week study for a 6 hour a week course, 5 hours a week max would be my idea because logically it would make 16 hours a week, full time is 3 modules a term so that would be 24 hours a week on average.

But it is how I was treated each time so I could not of been given the same information each time by the dwp, also would not explain how I know people who are part time at uni doing 6 hours a week in class could claim benefits and be classed as part time.

People can't "claim" anything - you have to back it up with evidence, and "your idea" of what the study time should be is utterly, utterly irrelevant. The university runs the course, and if they say you should do 40 hours a week private study (incredibly unlikely - is there any reason why you keep refusing to name the universities/courses, then I could give you the actual answer instead of assumptions based on your ideas of what they should be!) then that's what you're signed up to do.

Your posts are also very hard to follow as none of the scenarios you describe are made clear. Why exactly can you not find an explanation as to why a part time student was classified as part time?

Viberduo

callum9999 wrote: »

People can't "claim" anything - you have to back it up with evidence, and "your idea" of what the study time should be is utterly, utterly irrelevant. The university runs the course, and if they say you should do 40 hours a week private study (incredibly unlikely - is there any reason why you keep refusing to name the universities/courses, then I could give you the actual answer instead of assumptions based on your ideas of what they should be!) then that's what you're signed up to do.

Your posts are also very hard to follow as none of the scenarios you describe are made clear. Why exactly can you not find an explanation as to why a part time student was classified as part time?

You are the one who is challenging what I say therefore you have to back yourself up, else you can challenge anything you want.

Why should I tell you where I studied? Its none of your bloody business, I have no idea the stupid mentality you have that you think I cannot find a explaination why part time is part time, I am listing scenarios that have happened to me and others, your attitude seems to be that I must do what you want, else I am wrong.