Tenancy Questions

MadameC

Hi,

I moved into a rental property just over a month ago and I've had quite a few problems. I would be grateful for some information on the following please:

1. Is my tenancy agreement a legal document if my landlords' signature is a photocopy? The property is managed by an agency as the landlords live abroad. Two weeks after we signed the agreement, we received our copy with a photocopy of the two pages our landlords had to sign inserted.

2. Our landlords appear to be using our home as their UK postal address. Is it possible to legally stop this?

Thanks in advance.

Owain_Moneysaver

1. Yes, it should be (although I am not a lawyer and it's actually quite a complicated question)

2. Just hand all the mail addressed to them back to the postman (or put in a postbox marked 'Moved Abroad')

G_M

well you certanly have a tenancy agreement since you are paying rent and getting a home in return.

whether the actual written agreement is valid, including all its terms, is a dfferent question. The answer is probably yes.

Does it make a difference? Is there a particular term or clause within the written agreement you have a problem with?

If you wish to be a freindly, helpful tenant, pass his post to his agent.

If not, mark the encvelopes 'Return To Sender - wrong address' and put back in the post box.

specialboy

Who are you paying the rent to? The agent or the landlord?

MadameC

Thank you for your replies.

Specialboy - I'm paying the rent to an agency who are also managing the property. As they forwarded the tenancy agreement to me with the photocopied signature I guess they think that's acceptable. But I will ask a legal expert to get a definitive answer.

G_M - It's not a matter of being friendly and helpful (which incidentally, works both ways). I have entered into a business arrangement with the landlords, whereby I pay them money in return for exclusive use of their property:it is now my home. My worry is that they could be using my address for fraudulent or illegal activities and I do not want to be involved.

anselld

MadameC wrote: »

I'm paying the rent to an agency who are also managing the property.

That is the preferred answer for an overseas landlord as you don't want potential liability to pay his tax.

Pixie5740

You pay rent in exchange for a roof over your head so you have a tenancy. What is it you really want to know about the status of your tenancy agreement with this photocopied signature?

My landlord lives overseas and any occasionally I get post in for him, mostly junk from mailing lists he must still be subscribed to. Anything that looks like junk gets returned to sender and anything that looks important I just forward to the letting agency. It's not really a big deal. Sometimes I get post for previous tenants and that's just returned to sender too except for one woman's payslips as there's no return address on it.

MadameC

I've politely asked two simple questions- the first, is a contract a legal document if one of the signatories uses a photocopy of his/her signature and two, can I legally stop the landlord from using my home as a postal address.

I don't get just junk mail from the landlord - I get official mail from the tax office and letters from banks. I have been here just over a month , and during this period I have received 18 items of post for the landlords - yes I've kept count. This is in addition to post (including parcels left outside my door whilst I'm at work) which I have received for other ex-tenants. Exactly what they are, I do not know as I do not open other peoples' mail. I have returned them to sender. Except one of the parcels which disappeared. So, this actually is a nuisance.

(Text removed by MSE Forum Team)

Pixie5740

MadameC wrote: »

I've politely asked two simple questions- the first, is a contract a legal document if one of the signatories uses a photocopy of his/her signature and two, can I legally stop the landlord from using my home as a postal address.

I don't get just junk mail from the landlord - I get official mail from the tax office and letters from banks. I have been here just over a month , and during this period I have received 18 items of post for the landlords - yes I've kept count. This is in addition to post (including parcels left outside my door whilst I'm at work) which I have received for other ex-tenants. Exactly what they are, I do not know as I do not open other peoples' mail. I have returned them to sender. Except one of the parcels which disappeared. So, this actually is a nuisance.

If you're really concerned about whether or not your tenancy agreement is legally binding then phone Shelter and check with them.

As for the post, you're making a mountain out of a mole hill. Either forward the post to the letting agency or return to sender. Simple. You've only been living there for a few weeks and it's quite common to receive post for previous residents because some people are too tight to pay for Royal Mail's redirection service.

BlaEm

Pixie5740 wrote: »

... it's quite common to receive post for previous residents because some people are too tight to pay for Royal Mail's redirection service.

Or some people pay for the service and the Royal Mail are incompetent and don't forward it on. Perhaps your landlord does have a redirection service which isn't being fulfilled, and they'd appreciate being informed so they can sort it out.

(Text removed by MSE Forum Team)

G_M

MadameC wrote: »

G_M - It's not a matter of being friendly and helpful (which incidentally, works both ways). I have entered into a business arrangement .....

Even business arrangements can be handled in different ways.
* mutually cooperatively
* cooperatively on one side only out of self- interest (eg to minimise the likelyhood of a S21)
* confrontationally
* strictly by the letter of the law

I made no recommendation - just offered you the options!

.... I pay them money in return for exclusive use of their property:it is now my home.

and as explained already, that means a tenancy agreement does exist in law.

My worry is that they could be using my address for fraudulent or illegal activities and I do not want to be involved

a) you are clearly not involved
b) it is highly unlikely
c) an overseas LL often forgets to infom absolutely everyone of his new address
d) before worrying about fraud, you need a bit more evidence to concern you than some probably innocent mail. Is there anything about the mail, or senders, that is particularly worrying?

is a contract a legal document if one of the signatories uses a photocopy of his/her signature

Already answered:
" The answer is probably yes."

There is no straight yes/no to this. The only way to find out would be to have the question decided in court. My opinion, as stated, is that most judges, given the circumstances (tenancy in existance, agent acting for overseas LL, etc etc) would rule 'yes'. But the judge might rule 'no' meaning the (still valid) tenancy would be based on verbal agreement and the actions of the parties (eg the rent you are paying constituting the rent due).

Even a solicitor will not give you a 100% definative answer. But frankly, asking a bunch of amateurs like me on an internet forum for a definative legal answer is mad anyway.

can I legally stop the landlord from using my home as a postal address.

Yes. You could apply to a court for an order instructing the LL not to use the address. If granted, and ignored, the LL would be in Contempt of Court.

Would the court grant such a request? Again, maybe, but far more probably not. You would certainly have to convince the judge there was a significant reason why such an order was needed. And a vague "the LL might be involved in fraud" or "It is a nuisance for me" is unlikely to be enough!

And such an application would almost certainly result in a S21 and then eviction proceedings as soon as the LL was legally able to commence them.