pregnant lady pulls over due to vomitting

Halifax402

Hi

My wife is 3 months pregnant and was recently driving home on a Saturday afternoon when she became nauseous & vomited all over herself, as she was pretty shaken up she pulled over on to a yellow line with Loading restrictions shown by white time plates, I imagine that whilst my wife was throwing up over herself she missed the white time plates!
She stayed inside the car drank some water and composed herself until she was able to drive home about 15 minutes away.
She was on the yellow line for less than 5 minutes as the CCTV shows.
We have been sent a PCN in the post which we have appealed and that has been rejected, we even called the council as we thought the rejection must be a mistake as it seems incredibly insensitive and that a sick pregnant woman wouldn't be able to pull over if she felt she was unable to safely drive the vehicle. We were also told that the council would consider it if it were a medical emergency.

Do we have any grounds to appeal to the Adjudicator? we believe so and have requested a notice of appeal form from the council as there was one with the notice of rejection.

We have since been sent a Charge Certificate taking the fine from £65 to £195.

any advice would be welcomed.

bazster

The council ticket experts are to be found here:

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showforum=30

I'd appeal to the local paper if I were you, they love this sort of thing.

wiogs

Get on over to pepipoo http://www.pepipoo.com/ as the people there are the ones who are more able to deal with this sort of thing.

Edit - beaten to it

Tilt

Couple of questions;
What was the location so we can check the Street View images, this will give us a better Idea of the location and so the signage/road markings can be checked.
Secondly did you provide any medical evidence such as a doctor's letter or other documentation to support your wife's condition?
Thirdly, you say you have received a "charge certificate". Has this been issued by the Traffic Enforcement Centre at Northampton? If yes, then there must be a bit of a time scale involved here so when was the PCN issued?

Halifax402

Hi

Thanks for all the replies.

It was on Uxbridge road, Hammersmith & Fulham.

The medical evidence is a tricky one, I can obviously provide evidence my wife was 3 months pregnant but when I spoke to the people that issued the PCN they wanted evidence my wife had been sick, my wife went home to bed after this happened, a pregnant women being sick isn't really something you would go to the hospital for, she had no idea she was going to get a ticket or that she would need evidence that she vomited in the car. We're encouraged not to bother doctors, hospitals & midwife's unless we really need to which she has done when she has had any pain during her pregnancy.

The reason the "Charge Certificate" has been issued is because have been waiting for them to send us a notice of appeal form since the rejection which came via an email with no form attached, it is due to arrive today as we have contacted them following the receipt of the charge certificate.

I think next time I will tell her to just stop in the middle of the road until the Police arrive and they can help her get off the road :-)

peter_the_piper

I'd be tempted to collect some vomit next time and send it to them.

whitewing

I would send them a copy of the 'evidence' that your wife is pregnant (not a pregnancy test though!) and a printoff from a medical website about sickness in pregnancy, maybe a clipping of Kate Middleton's sickness reports, and let them consider that on a balance of probability that you are probably telling the truth.


ETA: Obviously, I am not a lawyer so this doesn't constitute 'professional advice'!

Coupon-mad

The reason the "Charge Certificate" has been issued is because have been waiting for them to send us a notice of appeal form since the rejection

You mean they never sent you the means to appeal to the Adjudicator (and she would have a good chance to win this, you know! Adjudicator meetings are fair - generally - and she should appear in person with her bump sticking out! Add to that the premature Charge Cert...!).

OK so at Charge Cert stage you are in limbo, and should just wait for the next form, an 'Order for Recovery' because only then can you apply with forms to reset the thing back because you were never supplied with appeal forms for the Adjudicator.

Rather than waiting and worrying, you 'could' firstly try a strongly worded complaint letter or email (NOT phone call!) to the PCN Appeals Dept Manager (by name if you can find it) at the council. Outline clearly that you were never given any means to appeal to the Adjudicator so there has been a procedural impropriety (use those words) and now they have issued a Charge Cert prematurely which as they know, is fatal to the PCN as they've omitted the Adjudication forms for you, and should cancel it. Insist that it is wholly unfair at this busy family time for you, to keep you in limbo having to wait for an Order for Recovery before you can get this reset, when clearly things have gone badly wrong at their end.

But if that doesn't work you will need to wait and carefully read your options on the forthcoming 'OfR' form and post on pepipoo for further advice about asking the TEC to reset the matter so the keeper can appeal. DO NOT ignore the OfR if it arrives - do not rely on phone calls.

All complaints must be written by the keeper (the person named on the Charge Cert) and of course show evidence of what's happened in terms of the rejection email without any attachment. And of course, quote the PCN number clearly.

Halifax402

Quote: "Outline clearly that you were never given any means to appeal to the Adjudicator so there has been a procedural impropriety (use those words) and now they have issued a Charge Cert prematurely which as they know, is fatal to the PCN as they've omitted the Adjudication forms for you, and should cancel it."

Now that we have been sent a notice of appeal form so we can write to the adjudicator, should we cite a procedural impropriety on this form because we wasn't originally sent the NOA as none of the other reasons to appeal to the adjudicator that are listed really fit what happened to us?

Regards
S

Coupon-mad

So they've sent you an appeal form after the Charge cert? Yes you must say that's a procedural impropriety and explain what they did wrong.

And your (the keeper's) other appeal points again about the medical emergency. Tick that you will attend the adjudication, DO NOT do this by post as you have so much better chance just to turn up for the meeting. If you are the keeper doing the appeal then take your wife with you as visible proof of the story and medical 'evidence'. Your second appeal point then is 'the contravention did not occur' (because there was a medical reason that your wife should be exempted). The phrase that the 'contravention did not occur' is NOT denying it ever happened, it's saying in this case, that there was no contravention of a traffic order, due to an exemption applying.