One for the resident kitchen experts - truly British companies?

cddc

Paula Rosa are pretty poor quality. A lot of my customers come from a large estate built 10-12 years ago supplied with their kitchens which are all falling to bits!

Vampgirl

cddc wrote: »

Paula Rosa are pretty poor quality. A lot of my customers come from a large estate built 10-12 years ago supplied with their kitchens which are all falling to bits!

Oh dear I didn't expect them to be top of the range, but I'd hoped for at least middle-of-the-road reasonable quality.

Furts

cddc wrote: »

Paula Rosa are pretty poor quality. A lot of my customers come from a large estate built 10-12 years ago supplied with their kitchens which are all falling to bits!

I have worked on building sites with Paula Rosa kitchens, including IIRR Barratt Homes. With all the large builders building housing estates for the mass market the objective is to buy the cheapest of the cheap. Hence if the kitchen has lasted 10-12 years it has done well. Indeed there will be kitchens on such estates which will still be in reasonable shape after that time - it depends how careful and respectful the users are.

I am not a fan of Symphony Kitchens, but I have been involved with fitting hundreds of their kitchens into council houses where they are then expected to last 20-25 years. This is with the cheapest ranges. Of course they get abused and do not normally last that time. However for the money, they are deemed an acceptable product, otherwise they would not be fitted.

Far be it from me to risk being controversial, but if I in your position seeking customers to sell kitchens to, I would not want kitchens lasting 10-12 years. You require repeat business, based on a common myth of the seven year itch and people wanting to move house. With this new home goes the customers desire for a new kitchen and a new bathroom. If the kitchen was still in superb order there would be less incentive to rip it out and start again.

I accept you might disagree with me over this and rightly point out the quality of German kitchens. This could be verified if the manufacturers were offering a guarantee of at least 15 years, but ideally 25 years, in order to back up theclaims of superiority. Which manufacturers offer such guarantees?

So let us agree Paula Rosa, and for that matter Symphony, is mediocre, but if it is cheap, and lasts 10-12 years I suggest this makes it an acceptable product that exceeds many peoples expectations.

SuzieSue

Furts wrote: »

I accept you might disagree with me over this and rightly point out the quality of German kitchens. This could be verified if the manufacturers were offering a guarantee of at least 15 years, but ideally 25 years, in order to back up theclaims of superiority. Which manufacturers offer such guarantees?

I could have afforded a German kitchen, but decided that a mid-range one would be more suitable.

I bought a new build house from Barratts 17 years ago and replaced my kitchen about 4 years ago with a JJO kitchen. So my Barratt's kitchen lasted 13 years, but could have lasted a lot longer but I wanted to change it.

Furts

SuzieSue wrote: »

I could have afforded a German kitchen, but decided that a mid-range one would be more suitable.

I bought a new build house from Barratts 17 years ago and replaced my kitchen about 4 years ago with a JJO kitchen. So my Barratt's kitchen lasted 13 years, but could have lasted a lot longer but I wanted to change it.

Thanks for this response - it backs up my general view on kitchens and the suggestions I would make.

You have a Barratt Home originally fiitted with a Paula Rosa kitchen. Barratt bought this product at an incredibly low price, but followed fundamental principles. First, never buy flat pack- always buy rigid carcasses. Second, avoid flimsy hardboard back panels, sub-standard carcass thickness, 28mm laminate worktops, poor quality laminate finishes...etc. Third, have the kitchen professionally installed. Fourth, have decent hinges, runners and handles. (You probably got basic 90 degree hinges, and probably basic drawer runners, but that is because customers tend not to look at such details!)

The result is this standard of UK made kitchen meets the requirements of the majority of people and will last an acceptable time provided it is not abused.

I accept that hi spec and up market new build kitchens will often be German. However such kitchens come at a premium price to the average consumer.

Vampgirl

Furts wrote: »

So let us agree Paula Rosa, and for that matter Symphony, is mediocre, but if it is cheap, and lasts 10-12 years I suggest this makes it an acceptable product that exceeds many peoples expectations.

Thanks - that makes me feel a bit better Our builder is Taylor Wimpey and whilst I'm certainly not expecting the earth (we all know that builders go for the cheapest option they can get away with) I'd like to think that it was reasonable quality and will last us a good few years.

We've just moved out of a 10 year old David Wilson house and the kitchen in that still looks absolutely fine (tho not to my taste!) - we were there for over 5 years so I expect that there were only a couple of tenants in there before us. No idea what make that kitchen was, but if our new one stands up as well as that one then I'll be well happy.

I do agree about really expensive kitchens....for most of us they are an unnecessary luxury when we'll probably want to update them as our needs/tastes change.

I'd best toddle on over to the "is this quote fair" board now and see what you all think of the island unit quote I have from Manhatten/Paula Rosa...seemed expensive to me, but then I have no idea what is normal in terms of price for kitchens

SuzieSue

Vampgirl wrote: »

I do agree about really expensive kitchens....for most of us they are an unnecessary luxury when we'll probably want to update them as our needs/tastes change.

Yes, the only point of having a very expensive kithen is to be able to show it off to your friends. For most people, a mid-range kitchen is perfectly adequate as long as it is fitted properly.

cddc

Furts...I dont sell German Kitchens and agree that for most peoples purposes buying one is an over the top extravagance. They have some very nice design touches you don't see on most UK made kitchens, and I have seen 30 year old ones which are as solid as the day they came out of the factory but of course the styling screams 1980s!

I work for Wickes. Not a high end indy. But I would expect a decent UK made kitchen to last 15-25 years, and most will unless they are poorly fitted and given a very hard life. We guarantee our "Style" carcasses for 15 years.

10-12 years , or less, for me is what you get out of a real bottom end kitchen. Remember these Paula Rosa ones are in houses that are in general privately owned and that people are inclined to look after well.
So therefore I would not recommend them!

Doozergirl

My bathroom customer last week wants to change the kitchen worktops in their not so new, new build (ie. time to start changing things which I think looks a bit more than 10 years) They don't want to change the kitchen as it's a Paula Rosa. They said it as if it was of high end. I did try to look encouraging, but I'd bever heard of it, so I'm learning more than I thought here!

I have to be careful taking my husband as he's always likley to put his foot in it over something. This time it was the original choice of bathroom tiles, which of course, my client picked themselves when the house was built.

Thanks for continuing this conversation. Ryder, you were particularly helpful last night with your explanations for me, thank you. The rest of you have definitely given me things to think about.

Tried to make a phonecall about CAD software this afternoon. You'd think they didn't want to sell it!