Dead laptop - bought 16 months ago

DCTrekkie_2

Hi

I bought a laptop online in June last year that was working fine until a couple of days ago when it started turning itself off at random, and then last night switched off and won't come back on at all.

I was going to take it to a local computer repair shop, but is it worth me contacting the retailer or manufacturer first to see if they'll repair it? It's outside of their (12 month) warranty period, but looking at the DSR information on MSE website goods should be "fit for purpose and last for a reasonable length of time". I don't think 16 months is a reasonable lifespan for a £600 laptop, but I don't know what the legal meaning of "reasonable time" would be.

At the moment I don't know what the cause of the problem is, although I know I haven't done anything that could damage it, so i'm assuming a part has failed rather than getting physically broken. Is it worth getting the repair shop to diagnose it before
contacting the retailer, or is that potentially a waste of money?

Esqui

You should indeed go for it. First step is to try the manufacturer - they have no legal responsibility to do anything, but if they do, it might be the easiest of the routes. If they say no, then move on.


Second step is to contact the retailer. They might also offer something no-questions-asked. If they don't, then you should get the local repair shop to inspect the laptop and give you a written report stating the fault, and how it was caused (e.g. premature failure of part). Then, give the report to the retailer whilst screaming "Well how d'ya like THEM Apples", and watch as they are legally required to do something


Although, before doing any of that, do try a couple of quick fixes. If it's not powering on at all (no lights), remove the battery and adaptor, then hold the power button down for 15seconds (or 30 if you like). Then reconnect the adaptor, and see if it works. If it's got a power light but nothing else, try reseating the RAM - taking it out, and putting it back in.

DCTrekkie_2

Esqui wrote: »

You should indeed go for it. First step is to try the manufacturer - they have no legal responsibility to do anything, but if they do, it might be the easiest of the routes. If they say no, then move on.

Thanks for the quick response, I'll get an email sent to the manufacturer tonight. I didn't wan't to go in demanding something I'm not entitled to, but I suppose it doesn't hurt to ask.

Esqui wrote: »

Although, before doing any of that, do try a couple of quick fixes. If it's not powering on at all (no lights), remove the battery and adaptor, then hold the power button down for 15seconds (or 30 if you like). Then reconnect the adaptor, and see if it works. If it's got a power light but nothing else, try reseating the RAM - taking it out, and putting it back in.

Unfortunately none of the components (including the battery) are accessible without dismantling half the laptop. Whilst I'm fairly technical and could probably take it apart and reassemble it ok, I'm concerned that the manufacturer would refuse to do anything with it afterwards due to it being "tampered with".

I've checked the charger cable with a multimeter, and it seems to be working ok, and I've tried pressing the power button with & without the charger plugged in, but there's no sign of life. No LED's come on and the fans don't start up.

unholyangel

A reasonable length of time is a question of fact - which means that only a court can ultimately decide what a reasonable time is and they would do so based on all relevant circumstances.

For example you wouldnt expect a £250 laptop to last as long or be as good as a £1500 one, would you?

And while you are right that items should last a reasonable length of time...it does not mean that goods should last that long no matter what.

Sale of Goods Act only covers instances where the goods do not conform to contract (ie they're faulty, not as described etc). If you dropped your laptop for example....it may not have lasted a reasonable length of time but the reason it hasnt is because of misuse, not because the goods don't conform to contract.

Hope that helps explain that part for you.

I'm no expert, but what you said about laptop shutting down randomly then not powering up at all sounds like an overheating issue to me.

However good advice given above, there is certainly no harm in contacting the manufacturer/retailer and seeing if they're willing to at least look at it for you without the need of an independent report.

unholyangel

DCTrekkie wrote: »

I've checked the charger cable with a multimeter, and it seems to be working ok, and I've tried pressing the power button with & without the charger plugged in, but there's no sign of life. No LED's come on and the fans don't start up.

You might be lucky and it might be a faulty power button....but imo its more than likely your motherboard is fried.

DCTrekkie_2

unholyangel wrote: »

A reasonable length of time is a question of fact - which means that only a court can ultimately decide what a reasonable time is and they would do so based on all relevant circumstances.

Yeah, I was just hoping there might be some sort of guidelines with a rough idea what's reasonable.

unholyangel wrote: »

You might be lucky and it might be a faulty power button....but imo its more than likely your motherboard is fried.

If it is something like this do you think it would be considered a faulty part under the DSR, or just normal "wear & tear"?

unholyangel wrote: »

For example you wouldnt expect a £250 laptop to last as long or be as good as a £1500 one, would you?

No, in my opinion a £600 laptop should last more then 16 months, but I was looking for feedback on whether I was being realistic or not. I'm aware that there's no definitive answer.

unholyangel wrote: »

And while you are right that items should last a reasonable length of time...it does not mean that goods should last that long no matter what.

Sale of Goods Act only covers instances where the goods do not conform to contract (ie they're faulty, not as described etc). If you dropped your laptop for example....it may not have lasted a reasonable length of time but the reason it hasnt is because of misuse, not because the goods don't conform to contract.

Hope that helps explain that part for you.

If it had been caused by something I'd done then I wouldn't even try getting it repaired out of warranty. I know that dropping it/getting it wet etc isn't normally covered even if it is under warrenty. Not only has the computer not been "misused", it's actually had fairly light use considering the spec.

unholyangel wrote: »

I'm no expert, but what you said about laptop shutting down randomly then not powering up at all sounds like an overheating issue to me.

That sounds likely, but if so it hasn't been noticeably hotter. The case hasn't felt any warmer and the fans don't seem to have been running any faster. Unfortunately, being an "ultrabook" none of the internal parts are accessible without major disassembly, so I'm limited in what I can do to diagnose the problem. To be sure I'd have to take it to a repair shop, and I'm loath to pay £40-50 just for them to have a loo at it if there's a chance the manufacturer or retailer will repair it for free\cheap.

unholyangel wrote: »

You might be lucky and it might be a faulty power button....but imo its more than likely your motherboard is fried.

If it is something like this, do you think it would be a faulty part under the DSR, or just normal wear & tear?

unholyangel wrote: »

However good advice given above, there is certainly no harm in contacting the manufacturer/retailer and seeing if they're willing to at least look at it for you without the need of an independent report.

This is what I'm sending them, is there anything else I should mention\not mention? It's going through a form on their website so they've got the purchase date\serial#\model# etc.

"Dear Sir\Madam

I bought one of your laptops in June last year, which worked brilliantly until a few days ago when it started turning itself off a random. Last night it turned itself off and now it won't turn back on at all. Nothing happens when I press the power button, no lights, fans or anything. I've tried it with & without the charger, and I've left it plugged in for 24 hours in case it was just really slow charging. The laptop hasn't been dropped, gotten wet or anything like that so I'm assuming the problem is a part failure rather than physical damage. What are my options for getting it repaired?

Kind Regards
Dctrekkie"

forgotmyname

Before you contact the manufacturer find out why its shutting down. getting too warm because dust has settled in the cooling fins?

Than happened to me daughters laptop.

If you send it off to them and they find its just that then expect a large repair bill.

unholyangel

DCTrekkie wrote: »

No, in my opinion a £600 laptop should last more then 16 months, but I was looking for feedback on whether I was being realistic or not. I'm aware that there's no definitive answer.

This is what I'm sending them, is there anything else I should mention\not mention? It's going through a form on their website so they've got the purchase date\serial#\model# etc.

"Dear Sir\Madam

I bought one of your laptops in June last year, which worked brilliantly until a few days ago when it started turning itself off a random. Last night it turned itself off and now it won't turn back on at all. Nothing happens when I press the power button, no lights, fans or anything. I've tried it with & without the charger, and I've left it plugged in for 24 hours in case it was just really slow charging. The laptop hasn't been dropped, gotten wet or anything like that so I'm assuming the problem is a part failure rather than physical damage. What are my options for getting it repaired?

Kind Regards
Dctrekkie"

I wouldnt say 16 months is a reasonable length of time for a £600 laptop. I'd expect at least 3-4 years for a laptop from that range.

The most common reason (to my knowledge) for laptops overheating is fans being clogged/not being cleaned (which unfortunately isnt a fault, its classed as misuse). If it had just happened, I'd have told you to take a sniff around the vent/open it up and see if you can smell a "burnt" smell as this is usually the most obvious sign of something being fried but its unlikely the smell would still be there now.

As for what to write....I wouldnt say about it powering off randomly etc or mention you're seeing about a repair just yet in case they misunderstand that to mean you're looking for a price for a repair. I'd just say that you bought it x date for x price. It no longer powers on and you would expect a laptop of these specifications and price to last much longer. When writing to the retailer I'd say something like "It has been suggested I contact yourselves, the retailer, in the first instance as it may be of cheaper cost to you than reimbursing any independent engineers report obtained by myself". For the manufacturer, I'd likely just say "I was wondering if you could check if my product is still under warranty or (if its not under warranty) if you will inspect it to ascertain the problem given the short length of time it has lasted".

Be polite. Keep it short and simple (unlike my posts :rotfl:) so your wants/intentions are clear. Much more likely to get a result that way than giving a huge explanation of all the details - they likely do no more than skim read and if you write a book, they've already forgotten what the problem is by the time they get halfway through.

If you paid by credit card, you would have the same rights with them as the retailer - however its exceptionally rare for a card company NOT to request an independent report.

Few more things, if you do need to get an independent report and the report found in your favour (that it was inherently faulty rather than caused by misuse), the retailer (or card company if applicable) would then be responsible for the cost of the report.

Check your warranty. My partner thought he only had 1 years warranty on his HP laptop but it turned out to be 2 years.

And lastly, while opening it may invalidate the warranty, it would not invalidate your statutory rights (although if you damaged the wrong part, it might make it impossible to prove its inherently faulty). So if you're competent with computers/know someone who is (and the warranty has expired), dont be afraid to have a look.

wealdroam

And another thing DCTrekkie, you've mentioned it several times, but this is nothing to do with DSRs - Distance Selling Regulations.

This is purely a Sale of Goods Act, or maybe warranty, issue.

Not meaning to criticise, but it's good to get these things right.

PHYTHIAN

Most repair shops operate on a no fix no fee basis so I'd go there first and get a diagnosis. If it is a manufacturing fault then you have an argument however from what you've described, I agree with an earlier post that the laptop has probably overheated and fried your motherboard.

Re removing the battery. Which laptop is it you have? Never heard of having to dismantle it just to get at the battery. They are (always?) easily accessible on the outer case.

PHYTHIAN

Should also have mentioned...try posting on the Techie Stuff Forum. The folks on there are excellent at diagnosing/fixing this sort of thing.