Any business rates experts out there?

emv

We're waiting for a VOA reassessment for a very complicated property that was a care home so had no business rates, it will be a mix of commercial (class C2 training centre) and residential but also needs significant refurbishment (no heating, etc.). I'd like to get a bit of advice about what to do in terms of negotiating the lowest rates level possible while we are refurbishing, calculating how many beds we will put in the bedrooms, etc.

Em

lincroft1710

VOA will assess the property as it is on day of inspection. They will not negotiate unless you appeal the rating assessment. A property such as yours will be assumed to have heating, and must have had some form of heating, so doubtful if they'll be any allowances.

Depending on the size of the assessment, you may wish to employ a proper firm of rating surveyors (either local or national) to act for you if you appeal the assessment. Don't use the "£500 up front" or "50% of the savings" cowboys.

emv

No it had no heating, it's pretty clear that we haven't taken anything out of it. Because we fall between several VOA categories I'd like to chat to someone in the know so we can make sure we're not leaning more towards a more expensive one.

lincroft1710

A care home that had no heating?

The property will be assessed according to its usage. Which categories could it fall into? The most expensive category is a shop, anything else will be much, much cheaper.

emv

It hasn't been used for accommodation since the 1960s, there were portable heaters that the office staff took with them when they moved out apparently! It's a training centre but could fall into being assessed as a hotel/guest house on a per room basis/conference centre/holiday centre. We will live in so could do with some guidance on whether it's better to use some rooms as our living areas or keep them entirely for the business. Then we'll have some other staff accommodation, office space, possibly space for a village shop but it will be the only shop in the village so should be exempt from business rates. One part may be a staff flat in the winter & holiday let in the summer, not sure how to work that one!

lincroft1710

The shop would still be subject to a rating assessment and if it was run as part of your business, would not be exempt as it would be rated as part of the whole.

Any living accommodation which has its own facilities for living/sleeping, washing, preparation of food and WC will have its own Council Tax band, so you could have 2, 3 or more CT bands on the property. Only the local VOA can tell you whether it's better to have more or less rooms for your living accom, as only they know what price per sq metre the rooms attract, or what the CT band is likely to be. But they may well be non committal and just say "we'll decide after an inspection".

To be honest your ideas/plans are so woolly, it would be difficult for the VOA to give you much help. Had you approached me when I worked in the VOA, I would have asked that you produced a definitive plan of the building showing what the intended use for each part/room would be.

I think you should concentrate on deciding on how the business will be configured within this building/s, then think about the rating assessment. The prices for the categories the property could fall into aren't going to be that much different at the end of the day.

emv

Well, we had an assessment yesterday & the assessor was very helpful, he will revisit once we have firmer plans - which is difficult as we don't yet know how much of the building we can heat/supply water to. In the 1990s, the owners cut off all water supply to the floor with the rooms that we planned to use as guest rooms & we will need to supply a washbasin in each room.

The options seem to be to assess us as a field study centre, hostel or residential training centre & the rates for these seem to be based on price per single bad space but, looking at other similar centres, the price per single bed space can vary from £85 - £500. Presumably this is where facilities come in - i.e. a single bed space in a room without heating is worth less than a more luxurious room? Are we able to request which category we're classified in? How would the VOA assessor make the decision as to which category to apply? I have read the guidance for two categories:

http://www.voa.gov.uk/corporate/Publications/Manuals/RatingManual/RatingManualVolume5/sect885/c-rat-man-vol5-s885-pn1-2010.html


http://www.voa.gov.uk/corporate/Publications/Manuals/RatingManual/RatingManualVolume5/sect515/1b-rat-man-vol5-s515.html#P185_3264


http://www.voa.gov.uk/corporate/Publications/Manuals/RatingManual/RatingManualVolume5/sect

though annoyingly I can't access the guidance in relation to Field Study Centres, which is I think the closest to what we are offering.

Lincroft, can I just check - if staff accommodation doesn't include food preparation areas, will that not be counted as self-contained accommodation? We plan to have some rooms for volunteers but they would use the communal kitchen, lounge, laundry, etc.

Thanks for your help

Em

lincroft1710

If the staff accom does not have its own food prep area, then as you say, it will not be self contained.

You can't choose the category in you wish to be classified, it will be based on the usage of the premises. Quality, facilities and geographical location will all be reflected in the room price.

emv

Thanks. So we plan to use it as a bushcraft/outdoor education centre - it should then be assessed as a field studies centre? We've looked at as many similar centres as we can but they seem to be assessed as Hostels, Field Studies Centres or Residential Training Centres.

lincroft1710

It will ultimately be the decision of the senior rating caseworker for the area or category. With the more specialist or uncommon categories, this could be national or regional.

The easiest thing is to wait until the property is assessed and then ask the questions. Although being prepared and pro-active is a commendable attribute, it is easier to ask "Why did you decide X and not Y?" after the event, because you will then get a definitive answer.

emv

OK, thanks, I thought it might be the opposite, that it would be preferable to be more prepared but point taken. Presumably if they rated it as something that worked out more expensive we'd have to appeal. The manual talks a lot about taking receipts/revenues into account - of course this can't happen as we're not trading. So how can they make an assessment? We're worried about getting a huge bill that, as we won't be trading for another year or so, we just won't be able to pay. Is there some specialist advice that we should be paying for at this point?