If Britain were a U.S. state, it would be the second-poorest

ruggedtoast

...behind Alabama and before Mississippi, apparently.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/govbeat/wp/2014/08/26/if-the-uk-was-a-u-s-state-it-would-be-the-second-poorest-behind-alabama-and-before-mississippi/

According to Forbes however it would actually be poorer thant Mississppi as well.

If Britain were to join the United States, it would be the second-poorest state, behind Alabama and ahead of Mississippi.

The ranking, determined by Fraser Nelson, an editor of The Spectator magazine, was made by dividing the gross domestic product of each state by its population, and it took into account purchasing power parity for cost of living. Several other European countries were also included in the ranking.

Ranking by GDP per capita instead of just GDP means that states with mega-economies such as California, which has the top GDP in the United States (its GDP is also larger than most countries’), was knocked down to 14th place among the states when divided by its more than 38 million residents. Alaska comes in first, with a GDP of more than $59 billion divided by a population of 735,000.

Norway was the top European country on the list, between Massachusetts and New Jersey. Nelson wrote that the United Kingdom’s low ranking showed Britain had “no reason to feel smug” about recent events in Ferguson, Mo.:

“The United States may be a great place to be rich, we like to think, but they treat their deprived appallingly over there. We tend to watch reports from poorer American states with a shudder, thankful that our country is run along different, more compassionate lines.

But if Britain were to somehow leave the European union and become the 51st state of America, we would actually be one of the poor states. If you take our economic output, adjust for living costs and slot it into the US league table then the United Kingdom emerges as the second-poorest state in the union. We’re poorer than much-maligned Kansas and Alabama and well below Missouri, the scene of all the unrest in recent weeks. Only Mississippi has lower economic output per head than the UK; strip out the South East and Britain would rank bottom. We certainly have our problems; we’re just better at concealing them.”

Nelson argues that income inequality and racial tension in the United States are more visible because of factors such as “white flight,” which Britain doesn’t have space for, and Americans’ tendency to publicly discuss these issues.

“No one beats up America better than Americans,” he wrote. “They openly debate their inequality, conduct rigorous studies about it, argue about economics vs. culture as causes…. And the debate is so fierce that the rest of the world looks on, and joins in lamenting America’s problems. A shame: we’d do better to get a little angrier at our own.”

UK AOK?



Poorer than Alabama

I do have some reservations about this, in spite of using GDP divided by population. The UK would be the largest US state by some way for example:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territories_by_population

Based on my observation of the USA if you manage to get to middle middle and above, middle class. You are going to be a lot richer than you will be in Britain. There is no doubt about that.

When I go to a country however I always try and imagine what a counterpart of me would have there, and in America thats where the gloss starts to wear off.

I have seen poverty over there the like I have never seen anywhere else in the world. There is a struggling lower middle class (of me's) whose medically uninsured feet dangle precariously over the threat of unemployment, with no welfare safety net to catch them if they fall. They inhabit a labour market with limited mobility as people cling fearfully to jobs they hate, because they have medical coverage and no new mid or low level job will.

Due to my Tomtom's unwillingness to update it's maps, and some of my own interest, I have seen parts of the inner cities that look like they are part of the third world.

Crumbling unpleasant places, or recently chabged places like Ferguson, with no hope at all and miles from any employment. Unlike Tottenham with it's rioters claiming there are 'no jobs round here' a bus ride or hours walk away from every part of Zone 1.

I give money to beggars in American but not India because the American ones look like they are in greater need.

But according to this, we suck more than all of them put together.

[Deleted User]

The only similarity the USA and UK share is language. We are entirely different culturally, morally, ethically, educationally and a lot of other -allys.

We should not be comparing ourselves with them

Per capita GDP is meaningless really

ruggedtoast

Yes I agree that per capita GDP doesn't seem to work here.

I am also not at all sure about the purchasing power parity they use that makes America seem cheap.

If you have $5 you can go into somewhere like Arby's and leave calorically full. Whether what is in your stomach can be classified as food is another matter.


Vom

When I am in America I don't eat in places like that because I am on the company ticket and I thankfully don't have to. I probably wouldn't anyway because they sell gross food that will make you sick if you eat it for long enough.

In order to get an average meal that would approximate something I would have in England, with the addition of genetic modification, antibiotic saturation, and growth hormones, and minus the animal welfare (this is just the food business in America, there is no real alternative) I have to go to places like Applebee's or at least a Chili's.

It is here that I would dispute anything is cheap. You get large potions but they are not priced particularly cheaply. Once you have added on the mandatory 25% tip because your server is only being paid $1.17 an hour as a basic rate, I cant see that they are any cheaper than here.


This is basically like a Harvester. Add 25% for service and it costs about the same as a Harvester.

http://www.menuwall.com/menus/402

Likewise, the majority of food you will find in an American supermarket is the product of a chemistry set rather than a farm so I don't think is comparable. Not sure about fresh meat and veg.

Thrugelmir

ringo_24601 wrote: »

The only similarity the USA and UK share is language.

Though the language is the same there is considerable difference when it gets down to the nitty gritty.

System

ruggedtoast wrote: »

When I am in America I don't eat in places like that because I am on the company ticket and I thankfully don't have to. I probably wouldn't anyway because they sell gross food that will make you sick if you eat it for long enough.

You're missing out. Get yourself a Wendy's Triple Baconator. 1330 calories of pure bacon goodness.

SnooksNJ

ruggedtoast wrote: »

Yes I agree that per capita GDP doesn't seem to work here.

I am also not at all sure about the purchasing power parity they use that makes America seem cheap.

If you have $5 you can go into somewhere like Arby's and leave calorically full. Whether what is in your stomach can be classified as food is another matter.


Vom

When I am in America I don't eat in places like that because I am on the company ticket and I thankfully don't have to. I probably wouldn't anyway because they sell gross food that will make you sick if you eat it for long enough.

In order to get an average meal that would approximate something I would have in England, with the addition of genetic modification, antibiotic saturation, and growth hormones, and minus the animal welfare (this is just the food business in America, there is no real alternative) I have to go to places like Applebee's or at least a Chili's.

It is here that I would dispute anything is cheap. You get large potions but they are not priced particularly cheaply. Once you have added on the mandatory 25% tip because your server is only being paid $1.17 an hour as a basic rate, I cant see that they are any cheaper than here.


This is basically like a Harvester. Add 25% for service and it costs about the same as a Harvester.

http://www.menuwall.com/menus/402

Likewise, the majority of food you will find in an American supermarket is the product of a chemistry set rather than a farm so I don't think is comparable. Not sure about fresh meat and veg.

Thank you for pumping extra money into the US economy by giving 25% tips.
I would be interested in your statistical data that the majority of items stocked in UK grocery stores are chemical free.

SnooksNJ

ruggedtoast wrote: »

...behind Alabama and before Mississippi, apparently.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/govbeat/wp/2014/08/26/if-the-uk-was-a-u-s-state-it-would-be-the-second-poorest-behind-alabama-and-before-mississippi/

According to Forbes however it would actually be poorer thant Mississppi as well.




UK AOK?



Poorer than Alabama

I do have some reservations about this, in spite of using GDP divided by population. The UK would be the largest US state by some way for example:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territories_by_population

Based on my observation of the USA if you manage to get to middle middle and above, middle class. You are going to be a lot richer than you will be in Britain. There is no doubt about that.

When I go to a country however I always try and imagine what a counterpart of me would have there, and in America thats where the gloss starts to wear off.

I have seen poverty over there the like I have never seen anywhere else in the world. There is a struggling lower middle class (of me's) whose medically uninsured feet dangle precariously over the threat of unemployment, with no welfare safety net to catch them if they fall. They inhabit a labour market with limited mobility as people cling fearfully to jobs they hate, because they have medical coverage and no new mid or low level job will.

Due to my Tomtom's unwillingness to update it's maps, and some of my own interest, I have seen parts of the inner cities that look like they are part of the third world.

Crumbling unpleasant places, or recently chabged places like Ferguson, with no hope at all and miles from any employment. Unlike Tottenham with it's rioters claiming there are 'no jobs round here' a bus ride or hours walk away from every part of Zone 1.

I give money to beggars in American but not India because the American ones look like they are in greater need.

But according to this, we suck more than all of them put together.

I was unaware the US got rid of the Medicaid.

CLAPTON

what does chemical free mean ?
I am unaware of any product that meets that description.

Nick_C

ringo_24601 wrote: »

The only similarity the USA and UK share is language. We are entirely different culturally, morally, ethically, educationally and a lot of other -allys.

We should not be comparing ourselves with them

I think morally and culturally, we are a lot closer to the US than we are to the EU. We used to have a better education system, not any more. And I agree that the British lack the work ethic of the US. But I would be more than happy for us to leave the EU and apply to join the US. Based on population, we should qualify for 10 states.

Apparently Churchill was keen on the UK merging with the US after WW2, and the stumbling block was the monarchy. The world would have been a very different place if we had merged with the US. A world union of English speaking countries could have developed, with Canada, Australia & New Zealand following us - three more countries that we have more in common with than Greece or Croatia.

PS - it would be interesting to see where the State of London and the State of SE England fitted in that GDP list.

ruggedtoast

Here is a 'Hotpocket'.



An unremarkable, and ubiquitous, American food-stuff.

Here are the ingredients for a Hotpocket:



In my experience there is nothing unusual about this. Supermarket sushi is the same. Frozen lasagne is the same. Anything processed or pre-packaged contains a list of chemical components the working of which I can usually only guess at.

Food colourings and dyes are used in food that are not even permitted in Europe. High fructose corn syrup is in everything, including savoury things.

SnooksNJ

CLAPTON wrote: »

what does chemical free mean ?
I am unaware of any product that meets that description.

That's my point. It seems unfair to me that the US is being called out on it when it happens everywhere.