Call charges to 030 numbers

JohnDinton

MSE's UK CallChecker is giving incorrect information about the charges to 030 numbers from BT landlines. It has a single entry in the drop-down list for 01, 02 and 03 numbers. It shows the cheapest providers for those calls as 18185, 1899 and call18866. For all three it shows the rate as 0.0p/min. There is a 5p connection charge.

In fact all three now charge 3p/min and a 5p connection charge for calls to 030 numbers, which is similar to their charge for calls to 0845 and 0870 numbers.

OFCOM has spent several years persuading those with 0845 and 0870 numbers to move to 03 numbers, which were to have been charged at the same rate as 01 and 02 numbers. HMRC has now for the most part changed its numbers to 03. All that work has been undone.

OFCOM's response when I called was that it did not regulate the rates BT charged the indirect access providers.

Roger1

Well, OFCOM's response is at best unhelpful.

OFCOM themselves say:

OFCOM wrote:

What are 03 numbers?
Ofcom introduced UK-wide 03 numbers as an alternative to chargeable 08 numbers, such as 0870.

These numbers allow organisations to have a single national point of contact without consumers having to pay extra to call them.

Calls to 03 numbers cost no more than a national rate call to an 01 or 02 number and must count towards any inclusive minutes in the same way as 01 and 02 calls.

These rules apply to calls from any type of line including mobile, BT, other fixed line or payphone

Revenue sharing – where the dialled party can receive a share of what the consumer pays to make a call – is also not allowed on calls to 03 numbers.

http://ask.ofcom.org.uk/help/telephone/03number

I expected better from the regulator. And of course, it's difficult to discuss the matter with 18185. Perhaps MSE knows a way?

In the meantime, I'll avoid using 18185 to call 03 numbers.

JohnDinton

Quite.

In 18185's favour was that I was alerted immediately by the tariff announcement at the beginning of my call, instead of having to wait for the next bill to find out.

Given my experience with 18185 over many years I strongly suspect it is only passing on a higher price it is being charged by BT.

The way OFTEL and now OFCOM have dealt with the 0845/0870 issue has been a farce. About 6 years ago I saw some committee minutes on the website. They had decided the way to deal with it was to require operators to play a recorded warning message at the start of a call if the charge was going to be higher than the standard national rate. One of the industry representatives then pointed out that a recorded announcement would breach CCITT or ITU requirements so they had to start all over again.

I am reluctant to complain because I would not want 18185 to withdraw its zero per minute rate for calls to 01 and 02 numbers.

Roger1

JohnDinton wrote: »

I am reluctant to complain because I would not want 18185 to withdraw its zero per minute rate for calls to 01 and 02 numbers.

Good point.

notbritishgas

JohnDinton wrote: »

I am reluctant to complain because I would not want 18185 to withdraw its zero per minute rate for calls to 01 and 02 numbers.

I think the more likely case is that BT will prevent us dialling 18185 as some other companies have. I seem to remember that OFCOM has relaxed the requirement for BT to allow indirect access numbers (is that what 18185 is called?)

Back on topic I see on 18185 website that only 030 numbers are mentioned as 3p per minute.
What about 0345, are they 0p or 3p? I presume 0345 will be the code that firms/gov agencies will use instead of 0845 and 0844?

JohnDinton

I think the more likely case is that BT will prevent us dialling 18185 as some other companies have. I seem to remember that OFCOM has relaxed the requirement for BT to allow indirect access numbers (is that what 18185 is called?)

Thanks for pointing that out. I obviously haven't been paying attention. For anyone else who missed it there is a discussion here.
http://forums.digitalspy.co.uk/showthread.php?t=1894107

As one poster says, this is the reverse of what OFCOM should be doing.

There is also a thread in this forum about Primus and 18185. It seems that access to 18185 from Primus was only up until the end of 2013, and some users were unable to use it a couple of years before that.

gordon_k

notbritishgas wrote: »

Back on topic I see on 18185 website that only 030 numbers are mentioned as 3p per minute.
What about 0345, are they 0p or 3p? I presume 0345 will be the code that firms/gov agencies will use instead of 0845 and 0844?

0345 numbers are 3p per minute on 18185.

Got caught out with this doing my Tax Credits renewal the other day. They use an 0345 now - which of course "by law" must be charged at the same rate as a geographic number. But not really.

I guess the MSE Callchecker needs updated, since the present version assumes that 03 numbers will be the same price as 01 and 02. Sadly, ain't the case.

Buzby

0345 numbers ARE charged at the National rate. If your telco isn't, then you need to complain. A look at your carriers published Price List will confirm one way or another.

JohnDinton

When the derived services network with its 0800 and 0345 codes was introduced in 1985 national rate and local rate had meaning. They have long since ceased to do so. They now just cause confusion, because as far as I am aware no calls within the British mainland are charged by distance. Worse than confusion, the terms have been used by the industry to run rings round Oftel and now Ofcom over the 0845/0870 shared revenue issue.

It seems farcical that so much effort has been put into introducing 03 numbers from which shared revenue has been banned only to end up with a situation where the cheapest calls to 03 numbers are a similar price to the cheapest calls to 0845 and 0870 numbers.

I doubt if 18185, 1899 and call18866 are to blame.

There is no point in complaining because apparently Ofcom has withdrawn the requirement for BT to allow indirect access. The likely response to a complaint will be to accelerate its removal.

The MSE UK Callchecker is currently giving a misleading price indication for 03 numbers.

Ypaymore

JohnDinton wrote: »

I doubt if 18185, 1899 and call18866 are to blame.

Well who else is to blame then ? Its only this cheap and cheerful Swiss oufit who apparently dont belong to a recognised UK complaint scheme, who are charging more to call 03 numbers then 01/2 numbers.

All other mainstream and cheap call UK suppliers dont seem to have a problem to charging the same as 01/02 numbers or including them in inclusive minutes as required .One charging as little as half a pence a minute and no connection charge.

If enough people complained to Ofcom that they were not complying they would open a case and look into it.The fact that indirect access no longer applies to BT has nothing to do with the non compliance. Ever thought of asking 18185 and Co why they dont comply.

brewerdave

...Even with this "anomaly" via 18185, it is still cheaper to use them than your regular teleco. (if you don't have an Anytime tariff)
eg I made a call to an 0345 number last week during the day -3.5 minutes cost 17p -if I had made the call via Plusnet it would have cost nearly 50p!! (and after September nearly 60p!)