Paypal/chargeback/DSR

mikrt

Hi Forum,

Same old problem!

I brought a slate sample off ebay and decided I liked it. On that basis I ordered £363.00 worth of slates, not ebay, but paid with paypal.

After signing for delivery (Noting "Uninspected" on receipt) and then uncovering the crate, I find that all the slates are completely different to the sample I was sent (All the ones in crate are the same as each other).

Please see link below, top one is sample, lower one is what arrived.

https://www.dropbox.com/sc/0fzqmcjqv1zegcu/AACZlIyeA_N85aj3HDPb4OGaa

I do realise that there are obviously variations in natural slates, but they are completely different in colour and texture.

I have filed a paypal dispute, and the seller tells me to send them back for a refund, but that's going to cost a lot, and I don't think paypal will help with return costs.

The sale of good act states that I should not lose out when seller breaks the contract, which I believe he has, and that return postage costs are met by buyer only when changing their mind.

Should I wait for paypal dispute to finalise, or get a letter & email quoting Sale of goods act 1979 off ASAP? (Or is it different since last month?)

My worry is that if paypal find in my favour, at least I get my £363 back, but if I apply the Sale of goods act, it may take much longer and potentially end up in small claims court.

Thanks for reading, and for any advice,

Mike

shaun_from_Africa

What I would suggest you do is to go down the paypal route but before doing this, ask the seller if they will cover the return costs.

Once you have been refunded, if the seller didn't cover the return costs as required by law, there is nothing to stop you taking legal action against them to recover the money owed. Whether you consider this worthwhile, only you can decide, but I wouldn't be surprised if you get refunded simply by sending a "letter before action" to them. (Google this term for info and examples of a template letter you can use).

It's not 100% guaranteed, but as the law is on your side, should it reach the court, I can't see that you would have much chance of losing.

arcon5

Did you contact the seller before opening the PayPal dispute to seek a solution? Have they actually refused to uplift the item?

Looks like they've actually sent the wrong product!! Apples and oranges there.

mikrt

Thanks for mega-quick reply Shaun.

That sounds good, but I've already asked seller to pay return costs and he refuses point blank, and got a little stroppy, telling me he was going to make it as difficult for me as he can. I'm honestly not sure if he's genuine, or a con who's upset that I don't want to be out of pocket.

And, will paypal refund before Item has been returned?

One more thing, if I leave the paypal route take it's course, is there a chance I'll be out of time to use the SOGA?

Thanks again.

frugal_mike

There is no chance that you will be out of time for a SOGA claim, the statute of limitations is 6 years. Just make sure you keep all correspondence showing that you rejected the goods, and obviously keep receipts showing the cost of the return.

unholyangel

You say you bought a sample, but was it sold as a sample?

Were they advertised as generic (ie just slate tiles) or specific (x colour slate tiles)?

Actual descriptions/phrasing used when ordering is important. If you (for example) just asked for x number of slate tiles then they do technically conform to contract. If you said something like "same as the sample i ordered via ebay" then obviously thats a whole different matter.

Its the only valid reason i can think of that would entitle the retailer not to pay for the return of the goods.

mikrt

unholyangel,

The sample purchased was for a specific style & colour slate from ebay. The ongoing emails/messages from that purchase in the same thread through ebay is what produced the paypal invoice, which is how I paid with credit card funds.

Yes he has refused to uplift the item. I think he's ultimately waiting for paypal to go to it's full time limit before responding, with paypal probably telling me to return it before he has to refund the purchase cost only.

Regarding 6 years SOGA time limit, I'm obviously out of touch. I thought it was 14 days - quite a difference!

One more thing, is the SOGA different to DSR, or are they part of the same regulations?

Thanks all.

frugal_mike

The DSR has been discontinued (as of June 13th this year) and replaced by The Consumer Contracts Regulations. The new regulations are broadly the same as the old, but are slightly more business friendly. Neither the DSR or the CCR has anything to do with The Sale of Goods Act. This is an older piece of legislation that applies to all contracts of sale. The new regulations apply only to distance contracts and work side by side with The SOGA (they both apply at the same time).

The 6 years I mentioned is the amount of time you have to make a claim under The SOGA (time from purchase). The 14 days you have heard of likely comes from the new CCRs. These regulations have at least 3 different time limits of 14 days that I can think of, the most notable being that a consumer has 14 days to change their mind for any reason when buying at a distance (some items are excluded from this right).

shaun_from_Africa

The DSR's (Distance selling regulations) are an entirely separate piece of legislation to the Sale of goods act.
However, the DSR's no longer apply as they were superseded by the "Consumer contracts (information, cancellation and additional charges) regulations 2013" which came into force on the 13th June this year.

When you arrange for the tiles to be returned, make sure that you choose a carrier who will be able to provide online tracking and with a service that will also show if the delivery is refused by your seller. To win the dispute you will need proof of delivery or attempted delivery.

gik

The 'wrong' slate looks like it's reconstituted slate.

mikrt

So options are,

That I arrange for crate of slates to be returned at my own cost, then wait for paypal to refund the purchase price. Then use the SOGA somehow to get the returning cost back.

Or cancel the paypal claim, return crate, and use SOGA for whole cost?