Raw milk in Yorkshire?

geordie_joe

gik wrote: »

Based on fifteen years experience in the Dairy Industry and 30+ years as a Microbiologist I tell you don't consume unpasteurised milk...doing so has killed people. E. coli 0157.

You do know that 99% of all the people who have ever lived on planet earth have consumed unpasteurised milk, don't you?

DPJames

I'm pretty sure your estimate of 99% is way, way out. But whatever the figure is, what percentage of them have been seriously ill, or died as a direct result of drinking unpasteurised milk from a non-human source?

DPJames

Oops! Forgot. Never wrong.

bazzyb

geordie_joe wrote: »

You do know that 99% of all the people who have ever lived on planet earth have consumed unpasteurised milk, don't you?

But not milk from a different species. Big difference!

geordie_joe

DPJames wrote: »

I'm pretty sure your estimate of 99% is way, way out.

Think about it, humans have been on the planet, drinking raw cows milk, for tens of thousands of years. Pasteurization is relatively new, and even now a huge amount of people still drink raw milk.

Don't just think about this country, think about places like africa where milk is drunk straight from the cow, east european countries where a large part of the population still drink raw milk from their own cows, or the neighbouring farms.

DPJames wrote: »

But whatever the figure is, what percentage of them have been seriously ill, or died as a direct result of drinking unpasteurised milk from a non-human source?

Well let's look at some figures.

According to the United States Centers for Disease Control between 1998 and 2011 79% of the dairy related outbreaks were due to raw milk or cheese products. They report 148 outbreaks, 2,384 illnesses (284 requiring hospitalizations) as well as 2 deaths due to raw milk or cheese products during the same time period

OK, 12-13 years, 148 outbreaks = 148/12 = 12 outbreaks per year, in the entire USA.

284 requiring hospitalizations, divide that by 12 and it's only 23.7 hospitalizations a year in a country with a population of 318,429,000.

"2 deaths due to raw milk or cheese products". Lets split it 50/50, so 2 deaths in 12 or 13 years in the USA.

Hardly much to talk about, is it?

And don't forget, those figures are for "raw milk or cheese products". The cheese, as it is far more widely consumed, could be responsible for the majority of those figures.

geordie_joe

bazzyb wrote: »

But not milk from a different species. Big difference!

Cows have been domesticated for tens of thousands of years. I'm sure that mothers thousands of years ago started giving their children cows milk when their own milk dried up, just as mothers do today.

I'm sure the instinct to find a new source of milk for your child, when yours dries up, is not a new thing. It's probably been in mothers since the beginning.

So you probably could say that 99% of all humans have been fed on human milk, until the mother dries up and then they moved on to cows/goats milk and then drank that for the rest of their lives.

bazzyb

geordie_joe wrote: »

I'm sure that

geordie_joe wrote: »

you probably could say that

Well that clears that up then.

geordie_joe

Quote:
Originally Posted by geordie joe
I'm sure that

Quote:
Originally Posted by geordie joe
you probably could say that

bazzyb wrote: »

Well that clears that up then.

Was that the best you could do? That really was an embarrassingly poor defence, then again, your original statement was embarrassingly wrong!

Did you really think that humans have only ever drank their mothers milk and no other?

bazzyb

geordie_joe wrote: »

Was that the best you could do? That really was an embarrassingly poor defence, then again, your original statement was embarrassingly wrong!

Go on then, humour me. Please post the source of your statistic which proves that 99% of humans have drank unpasteurised milk from non-humans.

yangptangkipperbang

gik wrote: »

Based on fifteen years experience in the Dairy Industry and 30+ years as a Microbiologist I tell you don't consume unpasteurised milk...doing so has killed people. E. coli 0157.

Yes very true ! It killed my mother, she was only 85..............and my father, he only made 70.

I lived on it exclusively for my first 17 years (more than 15 !) I am now 68 and in excellent health.

If it is that dangerous why are all of the UK's dairy farmers still alive ? I suppose they must all go to Iceland or Tesco to buy their cheap milk..............