"Borrowed" Guitar

BadgerMatt

Do not get distracted by the discussion about whether what has happened to you legally constitutes theft or not. While that is relevant to the police and whether they can pursue criminal charges, it has no relevance to whether you can pursue a civil claim. Theft is a criminal offence, it is not a civil matter.

However, "conversion" is a civil matter. You can bring a claim in a small claims court claiming that this person "converted" your property. For this, you do not have to prove the person's state of mind was dishonest. You need to show evidence that it was your property, that you were entitled to have possession returned to you (i.e. that it was lent, not given as a gift and that you have asked for it back), and that the person knowingly converted it to his own use (i.e. that they have prevented you from taking back possession). As a previous poster said, you will need to write out our own statement, setting out factually (but emotionally neutrally) what happened. If you can get statements from other witnesses that would be very helpful.

You might not get anywhere, but in my opinion, if you are willing to put some time and effort into this, then it is worth doing. The best case scenario is that you don't even have to go before a judge. It's amazing how a court summons can suddenly concentrate people's minds.

But if you are going to do it, be quick. You have to start court proceedings within 6 years of the act.

Bufger

I've got this good friend called Karma. She said she'd drop by your friends house with appropriate levels of fortune

Bean83

SeduLOUs wrote: »

OK. By that logic I could walk into my friend's house, walk out with their guitar and 'claim' they gave it to me as a gift. They have no proof or written agreement after all...

Yep, in theory you could. If your friend couldn't prove that you took it without consent, it would be very hard to define a 'crime'.


As for the OP, the problem for the police is that there is no such crime as 'borrowing something for a bit longer than you should have' which is essentially what has happened here. The OP has freely admitted they allowed the friend to take the guitar; without any written proof of when they agreed to return it there is nothing the police can do as no crime has actually been committed. This doesn't mean it is right or fair, just that the police have nothing to go on.


However, I do agree with you that the OP should not just roll over and give up; if it were me I would definitely pursue it through the small claims.

tallgirld

I don't think you should do anything. Trying to chase it will be stressful and I doubt you will get your guitar or your money back. Put it down to experience. I learnt the hard way as I have lost loads of stuff/money. Now I will NEVER lend what I can not afford to lose.
Seeing that I can not afford to lose anything else I have STOPPED lending!!

Brian_Steele

It isn't theft, because he originally had the guitar with your permission. Strictly speaking, it is "conversion", which is not a crime unless it is done fraudulently. Thus, ultimately, it is indeed a civil matter. You can employ a collection agency to track him down for a percentage of the debt, although 10% is a common fee and you have to think about how much effort they will make for £60. Perhaps if he is such a toe-rag, his family might have no qualms in giving you his address if you just ask them. Then Small Claims court would be an ideal avenue. It will cost a few quid in court fees, but these are added to the claim - as long as he has the wherewithall to pay.

chrisdy34

Could you contact the family and say you'd like to get in touch with your 'old mate' (maybe by phone so they can't double check with him/her first) and see if they'll give you an address....

adouglasmhor

SeduLOUs wrote: »

OK. By that logic I could walk into my friend's house, walk out with their guitar and 'claim' they gave it to me as a gift. They have no proof or written agreement after all....

That bears no resemblace to the situation described I can only assume your indignation is making you post in anger.

markjam82

As a guitar lover this story has caught my attention. I can sympathise with you on a cost level as I had a similar experience a couple of years ago. My experience involved lending £500 (and a hoover) to an ex girlfriend. It's a long story but she needed the money for a deposit for a rental property promising me that she'd give it back a week later. I also lent her my hoover.
3 weeks passed and I saw not a penny. Only a barrage of excuses and being accused of moaning about 'money' too much. The money caused arguments which unlimitedly lend to me splitting up with her. She blocked me on Facebook and ignored my calls to asking for the money back. I couldn't prove that I'd lent her the cash so I had to put it down to a life experience.

IMO you'd be better off putting your efforts into saving up and buying another guitar as apposed to tracking this idiot down. He's done it once, he'll probably do it again so trust that karma will take its course down the line and the next person he steals from wont be so forgiving

Hope this helps to at least ease the pain.

Mark

XRAT

I'm with 'BigAunty' on the Small claims thing. Experience tells me that a judgement in your favour means nothing. Pay for court bailiffs and even if they can be bothered to levy distress - (and it's unlikely that they can be bothered to leave the office)... it's just good money after bad.
Either "send the boys round" or give it up.

Jurassic_spark_2

I am really sorry to hear that the guitar has never been returned. Put it down to experience and get on with your life.
Next time someone wants to "borrow" something of yours. Say sorry but no. I know it is a hard lesson to learn. I know £600 is a lot of money to lose. Instead of spending time worrying about this. Get a new guitar, if you haven't already and enjoy playing it. Maybe you could get enough cash from busking to cancel out your loss, and make new mates into the bargain.:)