Distance selling regs, non-refundable deposit & live animals

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

psammead wrote: »

#7 it is clearly stated on her website. Plus the buyer isn't disputing whether it's legal or not, just doesn't make a difference!

That's exactly what the buyer is disputing, if the non-refundable deposit is legal the buyer has no claim, if it's not she'll have to refund it.

If the regs entitle the customer to cancel and receive their deposit back, claiming it's non-refundable would be misleading and thus illegal.

A website isn't a durable means of providing information so I'm not sure if this holds up as part of a contract.

psammead

#11 so does that mean she would have to sell the animal to a home where she knew it wouldn't be properly cared for? Isn't that why all these reforming centres do home checks before rehoming a pet? She was basing it on those principals and the RSPCA inspector said it wasn't required but that it was nice to see. Also it gives her peace of mind so find out she could then be done for breach of contract seems so unfair.

#12 fair point! What I meant was the buyer has agreed the deposit was non refundable but she is saying that it makes no difference as the DSR states she can cancel the sale within a set period. Unfortunately I can't find anything that states this means you can get your deposit back regardless.

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

psammead wrote: »

#11 so does that mean she would have to sell the animal to a home where she knew it wouldn't be properly cared for? Isn't that why all these reforming centres do home checks before rehoming a pet? She was basing it on those principals and the RSPCA inspector said it wasn't required but that it was nice to see. Also it gives her peace of mind so find out she could then be done for breach of contract seems so unfair.

I don't know what the law is on selling animals but if she agrees a sale, takes a deposit and upon delivery there's bunny heads hanging on the walls she'd have good cause to refuse to sell but if she just doesn't feel the buyer is right my understanding is she'd have to sell or breach the contract as there's noting to demonstrate why she's refusing to sell other than gut instinct.

psammead wrote: »

#12 fair point! What I meant was the buyer has agreed the deposit was non refundable but she is saying that it makes no difference as the DSR states she can cancel the sale within a set period. Unfortunately I can't find anything that states this means you can get your deposit back regardless.

I can't see anything that suggests you get the deposit back but also can't see anything which suggests you don't for distance sale which is why she's best taking proper advice.

Trading standards is a start but if she phones the local council and asks for trading standards they usually put you through to a call centre whose advice I would not trust.

Our previous council had a "consumer protection" department who could then pass you to an officer but it depends on the local council, how helpful they are and what you ask for.

psammead

I've found something from a newspaper report which state a deposit is an agreement to complete the sale and can only be refund if a 'time of essense' clause has been to the contract. If the buyer fails to complete the sale or cancels the sale then the deposit is forfeit.

Unfortunately this was from 2009 and was about the sale of a car. I also can't find anything else she can use to back this claim up

I'll tell her to ring citizens advice but as the buyer has already suggested this I suspect I can guess the answer.

Auntie-Dolly

If it is stressing her that much why doesn't she just refund them? The pigs weren't bred to order, and presumably she doesn't do away with them if she doesn't find a buyer so she isn't really in a worse position than if these 'buyers' hadn't come along.

photome

Auntie-Dolly wrote: »

If it is stressing her that much why doesn't she just refund them? The pigs weren't bred to order, and presumably she doesn't do away with them if she doesn't find a buyer so she isn't really in a worse position than if these 'buyers' hadn't come along.

Makes sense to me, rightly or wrongly its the least stressful option

molerat

You have mentioned Paypal. How was the payment made, goods/purchase or pay friends/family. If goods then all the purchaser has to do is INR, slam dunk refund.

Refund is the least stressful option, if the animals are that sought after and she has a good name in the breeding world then they will be sold in no time anyway. No point getting worked up over something that will mean no real loss but just a fairly minor inconvenience. Bad mouthing by a disgruntled buyer could have a much more negative impact on her business.

wealdroam

OP, read this:

Is a deposit ever refundable?

psammead

#19

Thank you for that. Most helpful?

#18

Not sure which PayPal payment was made but I do know from PayPal that items such as this are exempt from the INR policy as delivery cannot be determined.


#16 & 17

I agree, I said just refund, forget and move on, it's not worth it. But she said so what the point in making deposits non refundable then if they don't mean anything?

Now the buyer is claiming to have proof of similar cases where sellers were taken to court and lost, I have asked her to email them for this proof.

shaun_from_Africa

psammead wrote: »

But she said so what the point in making deposits non refundable then if they don't mean anything?

Deposits do mean something. They are there to cover any losses incurred by the seller should the intended buyer pull out of the sale.
If for example, your friend had paid out money to a pig washing company to have the pig tarted up so it looked nice when it was collected, she would be entitled to deduct this money from the deposit before returning the balance.
What she isn't allowed to do is to keep the entire deposit for no reason other than this is what her website stated.