Clocked mileage

stockport_hatter

Was hoping someone would be able to offer advice on a matter…..

My father-in-law (FIL) purchased a vehicle from an e-bay seller around 12 months ago although when buying the vehicle he didn't do any proper checks on it other than giving it a once over – paid via bank transfer the day after viewing it.

My FIL has recently come to sell the vehicle on and had a buyer lined up but the sale was cancelled as it was discovered that the vehicle had been clocked and the mileage on the vehicle was actually 50,000 more. We’ve had a look ourselves at the VOSA documents and can pin point under whose ownership the vehicle had been clocked. It has happened prior to the previous owner buying it, as we know from the V5 Registration Document when the vehicle was purchased by the previous owner and when the mileage was clocked based on the recorded mileage at each MOT test.

My FIL has contacted Trading Standards upon instruction by the police and they advised him to persue the matter with the person he bought the vehicle off. The previous owner has put it in writing that he has also been in contact with Trading Standards and that they have informed him that he is not liable and that any claims should be directed to the person who owned the vehicle when it was clocked.The previous owner has offered to pass on this information to my FIL for him to persue.


Has anybody had any similar problems before? Should my FIL continue to persue the matter with the previous owner through the courts (as recently advised by Trading Standards) or is he fighting a losing battle as it isn’t anything to do with him?

My FIL is hoping to get back the difference between the amount paid at the time and the amount the vehicle would actually have been worth based on the correct mileage.

DaveTheMus

What is the difference between what he paid and what it would have been worth?

AdrianC

Was the ebay seller a private seller or a trader?
How many keepers back was the car clocked?
What kind of value of car with right and wrong mileage are we talking about?

TBH, I can't see you getting any joy without the hassle and expense of taking him to court, and - even then - if he's a private seller and can demonstrate he didn't know, I think your FiL is out of luck.

Your FiL failed to do basic checks, the person buying from him (let's call him A) didn't. If he'd have similarly failed, then when he sold it his buyer (B) found it out, what would your reaction have been to A coming back to your FiL and demanding the difference?

Caveat emptor applies.

If he's a trader, you're probably in a slightly stronger position, because there's more of an expectation on him, but not much.

LandyAndy

Not sure how this works with modern vehicles but in the past this could simply have arisen from the speedometer/odometer being changed when faulty.

stockport_hatter

Thanks for all your replies!

The vehicle was bought from a private seller on ebay.

It's going to be difficult to work out what the vehicle would have been worth as it was purchased as a delivery van by the previous owner and then converted into a motorhome and re-sold. I have been trying to go on various sites to see what a bog standard delivery van (same make and model etc) would cost with the higher mileage. That would give us a rough corrected purchase price as the previous owner has disclosed how much he paid for it and so we know how much he added on for the conversion.

I think he is going to have to bite the bullet and sell the vehicle at a reduced price and mention that the mileage has been altered.

AdrianC - it would appear that it is 2 owners back that the vehicle was clocked. To be honest we have told my FIL that he should have done proper checks before purchasing the van, it's simple rules of buying a used vehicle.

The previous owner denies any knowledge of the vehicle having been clocked and claims that he also didn't do proper checks when buying the vehicle so the clocking issue came out of the blue.

bod1467

The legal position is that any claim your FIL may have is with the person/company he bought it from. He has no contractual relationship with any previous owner.

If this was a private sale then his chances of success are slim, unless he can prove the seller should have known about this. (The fact HE didn't know about it shows that he'd have a hard time proving it).

Edit: I was typing as you were posting.

colino

Unfortunately you don't have anyone to claim off of, especially as the vehicle was bought from an online auction 12 months ago.
If you buy from a bona fide trader, they cannot lie to you, neither can they mislead you by failing to disclose important information like mileage discrepancies.
Buying from a privateer, unless you specifically asked a direct question and have a rock solid confirmation of that Q&A, you have no comeback.
You also seem to think you have pinpointed when the mileage "correction" took place. The biggest bandits for this are privateers and driveway dealers and they do it when some honest soul has handed them the complete V5C and they never appear in the papertrail or it was temporarily in trade to, "Alan Smithee".
Incidentally, I'm always perplexed about buyers who buy conversions of commercial vehicles, what they thought their previous use was. Genuine, low mileage, well-cared for commercials are like rocking-horse poo. If they are looked after, they are kept until a big bill is looming.

AdrianC

stockport_hatter wrote: »

It's going to be difficult to work out what the vehicle would have been worth as it was purchased as a delivery van by the previous owner and then converted into a motorhome and re-sold. I have been trying to go on various sites to see what a bog standard delivery van (same make and model etc) would cost with the higher mileage. That would give us a rough corrected purchase price as the previous owner has disclosed how much he paid for it and so we know how much he added on for the conversion.

Don't muddy the waters with the van.The only relevant values to your FiL's case are what a motorhome with those miles would be worth, and what a motorhome with the accurate miles would be worth. What the previous owner (Let's call him Z) paid for it, and what value his conversion added to that purchase price, is irrelevant to your FiL. That's between him and the person he bought it off (Y). And he has a similar claim off his vendor (X) - the person who appears to have clocked it.

So for there to be any comeback on X, the villain of the piece, A would need to successfully claim from your FiL, who would need to successfully claim from Z, who would need to successfully claim from Y, who would need to successfully claim from X. And, at every link, the chances get slimmer simply because of passing time and missing documentation.

Unless this is ever going to land on X, it's merely a game of negative pass-the-parcel between innocents. And the music's stopped with your FiL holding the parcel. Like I said, how thrilled would your FiL be, if it'd been B that discovered, and claimed from A who then passed it back to him...?

motorguy

LandyAndy wrote: »

Not sure how this works with modern vehicles but in the past this could simply have arisen from the speedometer/odometer being changed when faulty.

Yes, but it appears the subsequent mileage was misrepresented.