Civil Enforcement Ltd

achtzen18

I am not sure if this phone and pay thing is a scam. On Friday the 27th of June, I parked in a Soho Road, Birmingham car park which said that the first hour is free to park and then it is £1 for every hour thereafter. Star park which, I found out later, is a Civil Enforcement Ltd company, issues a PCN if their T&C's are breached. Anyway I wasn't going to be away from the car longer than an hour. However when I got back to the car, I had gone past the hour by 2 minutes. Knowing that there is an ANPR camera on site, I called the number on the sign and paid for 2 hours, even though I was leaving at the time. I only had 1% battery left on my mobile when I finished the call which said that my parking for 2 hours was confirmed. The whole process had taken a good 10-15 minutes because I was a first time user and had to go through the registration process.

Since, I hardly had any battery, the phone died within seconds. A couple hours later when I recharged the phone and switched it on, I received a text from PhoneandPay saying that since I had not confirmed my vehicle registration details, my parking session had expired... meaning I had not paid for parking!!

I am surely going to receive a PCN. Should I call Civil enforcement and let them know what happened? At least that way I have been proactive in letting them know of a situation or is this all a SCAM?!

Dublindel

Your not being proactive! Your letting them know that your an easy target. Wait for a letter if you get one at all.

Coupon-mad

Does no-one read the top sticky thread any more telling NEWBIES all about how to deal with this scam? Wait for the NTK then beat it on appeal.

achtzen18

I am convinced this is a scam!!! Received a letter from Civil Enforcement Ltd today, saying that they issued a PCN on the 2nd of July and now 30 days have passed and I haven't paid/ appealed/ given the name of the driver etc. so I am required to pay £100?!!! Also, the letter says- Please be advised that the independent appeals service (POPLA) is no longer available for this PCN. If you wish to appeal and/or raise any concerns with us please contact us within 14 days.

But where is the original PCN dated the 2nd of July? I NEVER received it. Should I take this opportunity to appeal with them and also tell that them that I never received the original PCN or should I word it differently, saying that they need to first send me the original PCN and then I will make an appeal?

I'm sorry if this is already on the Newbies thread and I have missed it.

Dee140157

Oh it's another missing letter, that blooming post boy who works for all the PPCs it seems is so careless with the letters.

Send a strongly worded complaint with copy of all correspondence, oh wait a minute, just the one letter, saying that they have broken the BPA code of practice for not correctly issuing you with a PCN. It must be an error on their part that you received no PCN, not any reminder and only get a letter after the appeal deadline has passed.

Typical PPC scam. Get complaining to BPA

At the same time treat this letter as the NTK and send appeal as per newbie thread.,

In opening paragraph say that as this is the first time the registered keeper has received any information about this PCN, you are appealing as rk and expect it to be heard.

Coupon-mad

achtzen18 wrote: »

I am convinced this is a scam!!! Received a letter from Civil Enforcement Ltd today, saying that they issued a PCN on the 2nd of July and now 30 days have passed and I haven't paid/ appealed/ given the name of the driver etc. so I am required to pay £100?!!! Also, the letter says- Please be advised that the independent appeals service (POPLA) is no longer available for this PCN. If you wish to appeal and/or raise any concerns with us please contact us within 14 days.

But where is the original PCN dated the 2nd of July? I NEVER received it. Should I take this opportunity to appeal with them and also tell that them that I never received the original PCN or should I word it differently, saying that they need to first send me the original PCN and then I will make an appeal?

I'm sorry if this is already on the Newbies thread and I have missed it.

It is - the section 'too late to appeal - you think?' tells you to appeal anyway. You don't have to use the template but should write as the registered keeper responding to the letter only (not as the driver; DO NOT TALK ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED). You can say that you never received any PCN but the charge mentioned in the letter this week which arrived out of the blue, is clearly not a genuine pre-estimate of loss so this is your formal appeal in the absence of any Notice to Keeper. Conclude by saying you require a POPLA code or cancellation.

achtzen18

Hi all,

As advised, I challenged the PCN using the template under the 'too late to appeal' section. I received a letter from them saying that I could no longer appeal because the 28 days had passed. I used the second letter in that link under the 'too late to appeal' section - which basically reiterated that CEL cannot stop me from appealing to POPLA under POFA 2012. They sent me the same standard response (exactly like the previous letter) saying that I can no longer appeal because the time had passed. This time I complained to BPA saying that CEL is in breach of the Code of Practice and emailed them all the correspondence I sent and received from CEL. They are currently working on the case. I wrote another email to CEL and mentioned the POFA 2012 again and warned them that this has been raised with BPA because they are refusing to provide me a POPLA code. I received a letter from them today saying -

We have already expended considerable time responding to your representations. We have already clearly stated our case and cannot continue corresponding with you.

The decision that has been sent is final, and your continued failure to make payment will result in this matter being forwarded to a collection agency for recovery.

Any suggestions on the next steps?

Redx

yep, ignore them and wait for the BPA investigation to conclude and you get an answer

ignore debt collectors too

the debt collector issues are fully explained in the newbies thread, and you cannot force a popla code out of the PPC , only a judge can do that (not even the BPA can do so although they can sanction them for not giving it to you if they think it should have been done)

in other words, you cannot force the issue so see what your complaint does, it may get a cancellation, it may get a popla code, or they may do nothing about it, in which case its ignore for 6 years unless you get an LBA or an MCOL, same as its always been

the last point is, ALWAYS COMPLAIN to the landowner, trying to get a cancellation , so do this if not done already

then sit and wait and see what transpires

Coupon-mad

Ignore them - you were never going to actually GET a POPLA code you know because of the self-imposed 28 day deadline! Your expectations of CEL and the BPA were too high! The point of lodging a late challenge wasn't to get a POPLA code (but we do tend to ask because it would be reasonable to expect one!) but instead it was simply to make your defence easier if CEL try a small claim later on. But they NEVER turn up to well-defended hearings anyway so motorists can just defend, turn up for any hearing and claim £90 - £100 or so in costs, if that does happen. We help loads of people with these cases too and no-one loses v CEL.

You are simply in the same position everyone was before POPLA existed and it is no big deal to ignore letters but not ignore a real court claim if one arrives. No-one here would suggest a person pays CEL even if that happens.

achtzen18

GREAT NEWS GUYS!! The PCN has been cancelled.

So... you know how I had complained to BPA. Well, they asked CEL to consider my appeal and CEL decided to cancel the PCN

Coupon-mad

Well done!