Employer Asking for Bonus Back

MrJester

Handed in my notice a week ago today. Did not pass probation as I did not sign the document to pass probation, and handed in a weeks notice.
Received a letter at my forwarding address which my mother read to me, the jist of it states that they require it back because my employment is terminated before 31st May. I have no idea what this requirement is for, the financial year ends in April and that is what its measured within surely and then paid out in next months pay (May).

My contact states this about bonus:
"You will be eligible to participate in an annual discretionary bonus scheme with earnings potential of up to 12% of your basic annual salary. The company reserves the right to change, amend or withdraw this scheme as the needs of the business dictate. Please note that there is no contractual right to this bonus and no guarantee that any bonus will be paid."

The bonus WAS paid to me on pay day on 28th May. I assume they would of not paid it to me had I given them more time.
My point is that this is the only statement under the heading Bonus within my employment contract, and it doesn't state any other terms as to when an employee is eligible or not, and they are trying to basically stiff me because of 1 day.

What can I do here, how much right do I have if I don't pay it back and they take me to court or something?

EDIT: I found more details within some extra papers, none of this is signed by them or me bear in mind. Notable parts:

"
Non Contractual Status:

The policy does not form a contractual agreement between the Company and any of its employees nor does it confer any legally binding entitlement on any of its employees. Notwithstanding any other provision of the policy:-

the Company reserves the right at any time prior to actual payment of any bonuses to vary, amend, withdraw or cancel this Policy, or any part of this Policy, (including the right to any payment under its terms) at its absolute discretion from time to time as the changing needs of the business dictate."
note the part in bold, they can withdraw this policy prior to the payment of the bonus, not after.

And more:
"Bonus Assessed: April
Bonus payable: May"
So therefor they assess whether I can have bonus in April, so surely anything after this time is then irrelevant to whether I get the bonus or not?
They paid me the bonus, which meant I was satisfactorily performing in all areas to get it.

agrinnall

Have you already been paid everything that is due to you up to your last day? If so then you could walk away and they would have to take legal action to recover the bonus, and if what you have posted is correct then they might well struggle to win.

Do you need a reference from them for your next job?

MrJester

agrinnall wrote: »

Have you already been paid everything that is due to you up to your last day? If so then you could walk away and they would have to take legal action to recover the bonus, and if what you have posted is correct then they might well struggle to win.

Do you need a reference from them for your next job?

I've been paid most of the month, yes, it might be a couple days less but I am honestly not bothered about that.

From what I've read it doesn't seem like they have much to stand on, and would likely give up on trying to reclaim it from me, something like £300 as it was just a part time job.

With the reference, I'm not sure I need it, all my past jobs I've only ever had to get actual references once, and in the end I would just be honest with a new employer about what happened.
Also, is it not illegal for them to NOT provide a reference? They have to provide one just to confirm employment, and cant bad mouth people unexplainably in a reference either, so what's the damage?

Undervalued

JoeJester wrote: »

Also, is it not illegal for them to NOT provide a reference? They have to provide one just to confirm employment, and cant bad mouth people unexplainably in a reference either, so what's the damage?

No.

Except for certain regulated professions there is no legal requirement to provide a reference. They are entitled to refuse or simply ignore any request if they so please. They might be obliged to confirm your employment to the DWP or HMRC but not to anybody else.

If they do choose to provide a reference then they can say anything they like providing it is true and not deliberately misleading.

Certain firms may have internal rules limiting what their staff can say in a reference but it is a myth that there is any law preventing a "bad" reference as such.

I would agree, based on what you have posted, that they have no right to reclaim the bonus. Providing you are sure you are not bothered about the reference aspect then I would write back to them politely but firmly quoting the penultimate paragraph of your first post.

getmore4less

Their policy is a bit sloppy


many have additional clause like must be employed and not in any notice period at time of payment to catch the leavers.


Do you not normally work Fridays, if you handed your notice in last Friday you would have been working today.

MrJester

Undervalued wrote: »

No.

Except for certain regulated professions there is no legal requirement to provide a reference. They are entitled to refuse or simply ignore any request if they so please. They might be obliged to confirm your employment to the DWP or HMRC but not to anybody else.

If they do choose to provide a reference then they can say anything they like providing it is true and not deliberately misleading.

Certain firms may have internal rules limiting what their staff can say in a reference but it is a myth that there is any law preventing a "bad" reference as such.

I would agree, based on what you have posted, that they have no right to reclaim the bonus. Providing you are sure you are not bothered about the reference aspect then I would write back to them politely but firmly quoting the penultimate paragraph of your first post.

Thanks for that clarification, now I know! But still yeah I am not bothered about a reference, particularly as I have just finished university and am going from a part time job in a call centre into hopefully a completely different and rewarding industry.

getmore4less wrote: »

Their policy is a bit sloppy


many have additional clause like must be employed and not in any notice period at time of payment to catch the leavers.


Do you not normally work Fridays, if you handed your notice in last Friday you would have been working today.

I've had two weeks paid holiday up till the end of May, handed my notice at the end of my second week of holiday.

It does seem sloppy, though I now have the letter they sent requesting the bonus back, and I would like to enlighten some further information which makes me a little less unsure.

In the letter it reads:
"Please see extract from the Bonus Scheme 2013-2014 policy below:
Leavers:
Save in cases of compulsory redundancy or retirement at normal retirement age (in which case a pro rata payment will be made based on the proportion of the year for which the employee was employed), an individual will lose his or her entitlement to any payments under the Policy if, as at & including the 31st May 2014 they have either left or have resigned (serving notice)."

I checked in the documents I had from starting my contract, and it is very different from the above, but the title of this paper is Group Staff Incentive Bonus Scheme 2012/2013. I started in Nov 2013.

It reads:
"Leavers:
Save in cases of compulsory redundancy or retirement at normal retirement age (in which was a pro rata payment will be made based on the proportion of the year for which the employee was employed), an individual will lose his or her entitlement to any further payments under the Policy if, as at the due date for any payment his or her employment shall have terminated for any reason, if he or she is serving notice of termination (served by either the company or the employee) or he or she shall be subject to any disciplinary action."

Even if I can dispute that I wasn't made aware of any policy changes to this, which I wasn't (and how convenient it is!), the policy given to me at the start still seems that at the due date for payment (pay day which was 28th) I was indeed serving notice period.

But what are my rights in this, they have a policy setup which you would assume would give them reason not to pay me the bonus, but they've ALREADY paid me the bonus due to technically their error.
Nowhere does it say I have to pay back a bonus if I come under the Leavers policy (which I probably do).

Is it not right to think that, for the parts in which they do not clearly specify the particular case then they have no right to make such demands?
To be clearer I mean if a lawyer looks at all this information for me would they confidently say "Well, they haven't stated clearly what DOES happen if you come within the Leavers policy and have ALREADY been paid the bonus."

For the information they have not clearly defined in such a situation, they have no legal rights to demand?

Undervalued

JoeJester wrote: »

......... but they've ALREADY paid me the bonus due to technically their error.

That could be your problem here.

An employer is almost always entitled to recover an overpayment made in error. The exceptions are so few it is not worth discussing.

The quote in your earlier post seemed to indicate that you were entitled to the bonus according to the letter (if not the spirit) of the contract.

If that is so they have no right to recover it.

However, if they have paid it in error and, according to a careful reading of the contract, you are not entitled to it then they have every right to demand it back.

My reaction would be to write back to them with your original quote from the contract and see what happens. It may well be they won't pursue it further if there is any room for doubt.

Roughly how much are we talking about?

MrJester

Undervalued wrote: »

That could be your problem here.

An employer is almost always entitled to recover an overpayment made in error. The exceptions are so few it is not worth discussing.

The quote in your earlier post seemed to indicate that you were entitled to the bonus according to the letter (if not the spirit) of the contract.

If that is so they have no right to recover it.

However, if they have paid it in error and, according to a careful reading of the contract, you are not entitled to it then they have every right to demand it back.

My reaction would be to write back to them with your original quote from the contract and see what happens. It may well be they won't pursue it further if there is any room for doubt.

Roughly how much are we talking about?

Well it wasn't exactly made in error, what I mean is that if they had the chance they wouldn't of paid it to me but they already have now.

All of this extra information I have discussed is things which weren't in my contract (which I signed), it's just a 'Policy', so I'm not sure how much right they have over me when its purely a policy? And they have changed it seemingly conveniently to decide I owe it back.

I totally agree and think that is quite likely, I just want to have a solid grounds to which to explain my reasoning to a point where they won't bother pursuing any further, I want to get my facts and understand my rights properly before I do so.

We're talking just over £300. Which might not seem a lot, but to someone who is now unemployed whilst I look for my first proper career out of university is quite substantial to keeping me afloat over the summer.

Like I stated in my first post, the only thing related to the bonus in the contract which I signed was:
"You will be eligible to participate in an annual discretionary bonus scheme with earnings potential of up to 12% of your basic annual salary. The company reserves the right to change, amend or withdraw this scheme as the needs of the business dictate. Please note that there is no contractual right to this bonus and no guarantee that any bonus will be paid."

Whats the legal standpoint with a 'policy'? My gut reaction is that its the company's procedures and an explanation of how they do them, but in no way is a legal right because its not something I signed toward.

Undervalued

JoeJester wrote: »

Whats the legal standpoint with a 'policy'? My gut reaction is that its the company's procedures and an explanation of how they do them, but in no way is a legal right because its not something I signed toward.

A contract of employment is more than just a piece of paper with the word "contract" at the top. Policies, handbooks etc can all form a part of the whole contract. Also, apart for certain matters like recovering training costs, whether you signed it or not is largely irrelevant.

My advice remains as before. Keep it simple and just quote the original paragraph. See what they say then decide how far to argue if they persist. They may well let it drop in which case this is all academic.

MrJester

Undervalued wrote: »

A contract of employment is more than just a piece of paper with the word "contract" at the top. Policies, handbooks etc can all form a part of the whole contract. Also, apart for certain matters like recovering training costs, whether you signed it or not is largely irrelevant.

My advice remains as before. Keep it simple and just quote the original paragraph. See what they say then decide how far to argue if they persist. They may well let it drop in which case this is all academic.

Okay. Which original paragraph do you mean? And thanks.

Undervalued

I would use the following two quotes with a few words of explanation.

I refer to your letter of XX.

I do not accept that you are entitled to seek repayment of my bonus of £YYY and would draw your attention to the following paragraphs in my contract of employment.....

"You will be eligible to participate in an annual discretionary bonus scheme with earnings potential of up to 12% of your basic annual salary. The company reserves the right to change, amend or withdraw this scheme as the needs of the business dictate. Please note that there is no contractual right to this bonus and no guarantee that any bonus will be paid."

However the bonus WAS paid to me on pay day on 28th May.

The contract goes on to clearly say.....

"The Company reserves the right at any time prior to actual payment of any bonuses to vary, amend, withdraw or cancel this Policy, or any part of this Policy, (including the right to any payment under its terms) at its absolute discretion from time to time as the changing needs of the business dictate."

Therefore it is quite clear that as the bonus HAS been paid the company no longer has the right to amend or withdraw it.

Yours.....

Alternatively use some similar words to to that effect.

If something like that doesn't do the trick then you will have to think about whether it is worth arguing further. It is not clear cut.