New CSA System Advice

PreludeForTimeFeelers

hmc wrote: »

I wouldn't want a direct pay as I'm sure he would stop paying! He obviously will want direct pay to save himself money, the csa have collected for me for over 7 yrs
Do I have to do anything yet? I read I could save the £20 if I register soon

If you've currently got a case open then there's no need for you to do anything yet - your current case will be closed within the next 3 years, and at that point you can either come to a family-based arrangement (i.e. one between the two of you) or you can open a case with CMS. If you open a new case then there'll be a £20 application fee.

PreludeForTimeFeelers

jjj1980 wrote: »

I called them today re my case and was told that despite what I have been told previously, the fact that my ex has never been compliant, the case was put via CSA due my ex being abusive and the fact that we are now waiting on a court date for a Liability Order, my case will eventually move to CMS and fees applied!!!

I am absolutely furious!! Why should I lose out on the little they sporadically manage to collect from my ex and potentially be put back in the position of, if direct pay was started, having to face all his anger and abuse again when it inevitably ends up back with them for chasing missed payments???!!

Can anyone advise what I can do about this?

To be honest, there's not really a great deal that you can do. The current 93/03 systems are costly to the taxpayer to run, and require a lot of intervention by staff, whereas things are a lot more automated on the new CMS2012 scheme - closing all current scheme cases means that those case that can come to a private arrangement will do so.

Your circumstances obviously mean that your case is unlikely to result in a private arrangement, and as such there's a good chance that within the next three years or so you'll open a case on CMS2012 and may have 4% of any monies collected going towards the cost of running your case.

I honestly think that this is a fair solution - those who are using the service will pay towards the cost of that service, rather than the whole cost being carried by the taxpayer.

jules6810

My case is in the new system and has been since Nov 2013. The charges are not in place at the moment, I have recently received a letter explaining that they come into force from August this year.
My childs Father found himself in the system because of messing about with payments, and refusing to even discuss the situation with the child support agency, he finds himself with a deduction of earnings order. This has taken, at least 6 months to set up, because of his lack of co- operation.
Payments have just started for me, its not without its problems but its finally working. Hes now had a letter explaining fees and wants to pay direct to my bank account to avoid this. At the moment, I have said no, we have tried for 4 1/2 years to work out ourselves, it didnt work, hence why I am using the system. I have spoken with the child support agency and when the fees come into place, he will have as much right as me to say how he pays, hes jumping with joy about this and is already talking of with holding payments at Christmas so he can buy presents instead, unbelievable.
These fees are disgusting to both parties and the only people that are going to suffer are the children that this maintainance provides for.

HoneyNutLoop

jules6810 wrote: »

My case is in the new system and has been since Nov 2013. The charges are not in place at the moment, I have recently received a letter explaining that they come into force from August this year.
My childs Father found himself in the system because of messing about with payments, and refusing to even discuss the situation with the child support agency, he finds himself with a deduction of earnings order. This has taken, at least 6 months to set up, because of his lack of co- operation.
Payments have just started for me, its not without its problems but its finally working. Hes now had a letter explaining fees and wants to pay direct to my bank account to avoid this. At the moment, I have said no, we have tried for 4 1/2 years to work out ourselves, it didnt work, hence why I am using the system. I have spoken with the child support agency and when the fees come into place, he will have as much right as me to say how he pays, hes jumping with joy about this and is already talking of with holding payments at Christmas so he can buy presents instead, unbelievable.
These fees are disgusting to both parties and the only people that are going to suffer are the children that this maintainance provides for.

What you have been told about charging is not strictly accurate. See this post and the subsequent link to the consultation document: https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/65664702#Comment_65664702

In short, in his current position with arrears and a DEO in place, he won't be able to select Direct Pay at this time. He will have to pass a compliance test before he would be able to choose to pay you direct.

As for withholding payments at Christmas if he was allowed to pay direct, governments message is clear: to stay on direct pay you must pay in full and on time, every time. If he defaults, he just ends up back on collect and pay, with the encumbunt charging, and with limited chance to go back on direct pay in the future. It would be like cutting his nose off to spite his face.

As for fees being disgusting; you have an opinion, I have a different one. Some will share your point of view, others will share mine. Either way, you're stuck with it for the foreseeable future.

jules6810

Thanks honeyloop, what I have said about charges has just been sent to me via a letter, within the last week.
That's interesting what you say about him not being able to pay by direct pay, and compliance test. That's not what they have informed me, they said he would have the right to decide how he pays.
I am not arguing with you or anyone else, we can only go on the information thats been provided to us.
This obviously is a concern to me, because I have been messed about enough, not just by the father of my daughter but also by the new scheme, so I will take some of your information and call them again, perhaps with the knowledge you have provided I may get some straight answers. Once again, thank you for taking the time to reply

HoneyNutLoop

There are a number of different sources giving advice/info about the changes:
http://www.nacsa.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=64:payments-and-charges&catid=2&Itemid=599
http://www.dad.info/child-maintenance/child-maintenance-q-a
http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/england/relationships_e/relationships_children_and_young_people_e/relationships_child_maintenance/relationships_child_maintenance_2012_scheme/relationships_child_maintenance_administration/the_2012_child_maintenance_scheme_how_maintenance_is_paid.htm

If the info in the letter is different, it might be helpful if you could post the exact wording, as I cannot source a generic copy of the letter online. There has been much debate on this issue within government and stakeholders that is published online, that supports the info given in the links and published in the consultation response. It would also be helpful to know the outcome of your planned call.

PreludeForTimeFeelers

HoneyNutLoop wrote: »

If the info in the letter is different, it might be helpful if you could post the exact wording, as I cannot source a generic copy of the letter online. There has been much debate on this issue within government and stakeholders that is published online, that supports the info given in the links and published in the consultation response. It would also be helpful to know the outcome of your planned call.

I know that the letters are on the CMG's intranet site, but I'm not sure if they're available elsewhere.

PreludeForTimeFeelers

jules6810 wrote: »

That's interesting what you say about him not being able to pay by direct pay, and compliance test. That's not what they have informed me, they said he would have the right to decide how he pays.

He's got the right to request to decide how he pays, however he doesn't have the right to make that decision himself. CMS ultimately won't let him change service type where all the evidence shows that he wouldn't be able to make those payments. If a paying parent is on an enforced method of payment e.g. a DEO then they would need to prove that they could make full payments regularly, and the way to prove this would be to change to a direct debit for at least 6 months. Only then would they be able to ask to change to direct pay and have this change approved without needing the receiving parent to agree.

jules6810

I have contacted the CMS this week as I have decided, dispite previous problems, that direct payment would be a better to avoid charges for everyone involved.
Now the conflicting issues, CMS have told me yesterday, that as he was forced to pay via a deduction of earnings, he would need to prove himself for at least 6 months, so he would be paying fees during this time, then direct pay would be looked at.
I passed this information on to my ex, who then contacted them himself, and was told that direct pay could be set up. Unless my ex is lying (proven track record of doing this), then it seems no one really nos whether he can pay me direct or if he has to prove himself. The whole situation is so frustrating.

jules6810

PreludeForTimeFeelers wrote: »

He's got the right to request to decide how he pays, however he doesn't have the right to make that decision himself. CMS ultimately won't let him change service type where all the evidence shows that he wouldn't be able to make those payments. If a paying parent is on an enforced method of payment e.g. a DEO then they would need to prove that they could make full payments regularly, and the way to prove this would be to change to a direct debit for at least 6 months. Only then would they be able to ask to change to direct pay and have this change approved without needing the receiving parent to agree.

Thanks for this, would a direct debit still have charges?