Grant of Confirmation

buddy9

If the account is branch-based and the branch is in Scotland, the entry can refer to the branch and be listed under moveable estate in Scotland. However, the inventory is a list of all of the estate, not just items that need Confirmation, are there no other items in the estate?

Where there are two executors, the non-declarant executor, after being referenced in para 2 is also named in para 3.

It is not stated in the guidance, but the para 2 declaration needs to discount the possibility of the executors having previously being married to or in a civil partnership with the deceased. This is achieved by either stating this or explaining the familial relationship. You might have picked this up from previous posts on this thread.

andybw

Hi. First of all thanks to everyone who has contributed to this thread, confirmation does seem to be rather exacting in it's wording requirements and I have gleaned lots from various posters.
I am now aware that a basic address is useless for a property and and the sasine description often needs to be used.
I have searched for my late mothers property on the land register.  Every house in the postcode appears except mum's (only 5 in total), but mums was bought a fair bit earlier than the latest transactions for those. The property previously a council rental and was bought mid 80's as right to buy.

Can I get the correct sasine property description for the C1 form from the title deeds (held by mums solicitor) or do I need to apply online to search the register??

Many thanks to anyone who takes the time out to reply.

buddy9

andybw said:

I have searched for my late mothers property on the land register.  Every house in the postcode appears except mum's (only 5 in total), but mums was bought a fair bit earlier than the latest transactions for those. The property previously a council rental and was bought mid 80's as right to buy.

Can I get the correct sasine property description for the C1 form from the title deeds (held by mums solicitor) or do I need to apply online to search the register??

The Land Register was introduced sequentially by registration division - only 4 (of 33 divisions) were operational in the 1980s.

One would expect that the deeds held by the solicitor would suffice, but who knows.

GhibliFan

andybw said:

Hi. First of all thanks to everyone who has contributed to this thread, confirmation does seem to be rather exacting in it's wording requirements and I have gleaned lots from various posters.
I am now aware that a basic address is useless for a property and and the sasine description often needs to be used.
I have searched for my late mothers property on the land register.  Every house in the postcode appears except mum's (only 5 in total), but mums was bought a fair bit earlier than the latest transactions for those. The property previously a council rental and was bought mid 80's as right to buy.

Can I get the correct sasine property description for the C1 form from the title deeds (held by mums solicitor) or do I need to apply online to search the register??

Many thanks to anyone who takes the time out to reply.

I did the C1 for my Mum's estate last year and I just copied the most recent conveyance wording on the deeds, i.e., the one that was done when Mum bought it. It was accepted and the property was sold without any issues.  However, don't necessarily take that as proof that it's right, because I have no legal knowledge or training. I just figured if the description was good enough to convey the property to Mum, it would be good enough for the Confirmation.

I copied it from the extract from the Sasines Register that the Land Registry sent me. I had to pay for that, though.   Your Mum's Solicitors might be willing to give you a copy of the wording from her deeds.  If they're being helpful, maybe ask them if that wording will be ok.

edit:  this is what I put:

"Dwelling House:  [address here inc. post code] being the subjects described in the disposition by [name of seller here exactly as it is in deeds] to [Mum's name as stated in deeds] dated [date of sale as stated in deeds]] and recorded in the General Register of Sasines, County of [as stated in deeds] on [date it was recorded in register]."

Apart from the "Dwelling House:" at the beginning, it was an exact copy of the wording on the extract of the deeds.  The whole of the conveyance was several pages, all you need is the property description.  Hope this helps.

andybw

Hi folks. Many thanks so far.

I now have the sasine extract and it seems to read rather differently from what most folks are recording in their c1 form.  It was a council house and there are 2 different paragraphs that I could use (or extract wording from??)

1st Para.

SEARCH SHEET, COUNTY OF WHEREVER 12345.  0.016 hectare, with house 1 STREET, TOWN &c. thereon, part of 46.292 acres [part of Farm and lands of FARMA and FARMB], described in Disp. to Magistrates &c of Town, recorded 10 Jul 1964.

2nd para reads.
DISP by NAMED DISTRICT COUNCIL- TO JIM MIDDLE LAST and WILMA MIDDLE LAST, spouses, 1 Street Name, Town, equally and survivor of the S and S which subjects were last vested in PROVOST, MAGISTRATES AND COUNCILLORS OF BURGH OF TOWN, from where said Granter acquired right by Act and Order. Dated 10 Feb 1985.
(Then a purchase price handwritten under the paragraph)

Further paragraphs follow re mortgages etc.

Heeeeeeelp please!!!!!!!! 

buddy9

I think you can extract from the page and follow the example given by GhibliFan to give:

Dwelling house, 1 street, anytown, postcode

Being the subjects described in the Disposition by xxxxx District Council if favour of Jim xxxxxx and Wilma xxxxx recorded in the General Register of Sasines (insert county) 10th February 1985

Valued by xxxxx

andybw

buddy9 said:

I think you can extract from the page and follow the example given by GhibliFan to give:

Dwelling house, 1 street, anytown, postcode

Being the subjects described in the Disposition by xxxxx District Council if favour of Jim xxxxxx and Wilma xxxxx recorded in the General Register of Sasines (insert county) 10th February 1985

Valued by xxxxx

Thanks.  That just seems completely different from what is actually on the search sheet.  Are all search sheets are different from the clause you note above, and folks that have been successful are generally just extracting the relative information and putting it in the c1 in that wording?? Or are most sasine extracts actually in that format and folks are repeating the description in the sasine extract,

The description I had come up with and tentatively put in the box was:

Search Sheet, County of Nameshire 12481. DISP. by BOBBY DISTRICT COUNCIL--TO JIM FIRST LAST and WILMA FIRST LAST, spouses, 1 Street Name, Town, equally and survivor,--of the S of S--,which subjects were last vested in PROVOST, MAGISTRATES AND COUNCILLORS OF BURGH OF TOWN, from whom said Granter acquired right by Act and Order, Dated 3 Feb.1985. £12560

I'm a bit worried that if I don't use the actual conveyancing description in the sasine extract we'll have trouble with conveyancing once we try to sell the property??

Valued by xxxxx
Is that referring to the valuation on the sasine extract, as if it is then no surveyor is mentioned on mine.

If it is referring to the actual date of death valuation, then as we are well short of the IHT threshold I was just going to give. "Executors estimated valuation based on Zoopla property portal mid price". TUnlike a lot of Zoopla estimates, their value for my mums is there or thereabouts.  When I went to sight my mums will at her solicitors office the solicitor implied that an executors valuation would be ok due to being well off IHT threshold.

buddy9

My suggested entry is based on your title entry, it doesn’t look very different from the 1985 disposition. It is also in line with examples in Currie on Confirmation of Executors.

Valuation is date of death valuation. eg value estimated by executor.  I would say no more that that on the C1.

Keep in mind that if the house is to be sold, there is potential for capital gains tax if the sold price is substantially greater than the value you declare in the confirmation. You would not wish to undervalue the house.

GhibliFan

andybw said:

buddy9 said:

I think you can extract from the page and follow the example given by GhibliFan to give:

Dwelling house, 1 street, anytown, postcode

Being the subjects described in the Disposition by xxxxx District Council if favour of Jim xxxxxx and Wilma xxxxx recorded in the General Register of Sasines (insert county) 10th February 1985

Valued by xxxxx

Thanks.  That just seems completely different from what is actually on the search sheet.  Are all search sheets are different from the clause you note above, and folks that have been successful are generally just extracting the relative information and putting it in the c1 in that wording?? Or are most sasine extracts actually in that format and folks are repeating the description in the sasine extract,



If it is referring to the actual date of death valuation, then as we are well short of the IHT threshold I was just going to give. "Executors estimated valuation based on Zoopla property portal mid price". TUnlike a lot of Zoopla estimates, their value for my mums is there or thereabouts.  When I went to sight my mums will at her solicitors office the solicitor implied that an executors valuation would be ok due to being well off IHT threshold

Apologies if my post confused you, @andybw - as buddy9 said above, just use the information in the Sasines Register conveyance description to word the C1description.  On re-reading my post it does sound like I'm saying copy the conveyance exactly, but I just meant copy the information (names, dates, county etc) as written in the conveyance.   It's too late for me to edit it, unfortunately.

andybw

Thanks guys.  In that case I will take the information from the sasine and place it into your recommended format.

The estimation of house value I'll be putting down is actually a little bit higher than I think it will achieve but there's plenty of room below inheritance tax to add 10% to the confirmation estimate to avoid what you say.