Sacking a member of staff for Gross Misconduct

Aquamania

Opinion wrote: »

I highly doubt that I'm the only small business owner on these boards that--without contacting my solicitor--doesn't know the legal ins and outs of absolutely everything that crops up.

Speak to your solicitor

The internet is no place to seek legal advice

duchy

The OP has already made it clear they don't issue employees with contracts of employment so has presented themselves as an employer with little regard for employment law except for when it might turn around and bite them.

When you start to employ staff you have a responsibility to them to actually know what you are doing rather than wait til a bank holiday and beg for free advice (which frankly is worth the paper it is written on when it comes to internet advice )

All his questions however could have been answered by a quick search (to tide him over until today when is solicitor opened) so as well as clueless they are lazy.

cazziebo wrote: »

Geez - you're all being a bit unfair here! If Richard Branson, what's his name Bannatyne and Alan Sugar had to know the ins and outs of our very difficult legislative system there would never be any jobs created in the UK!

Dismissals are a minefield and even although I'm ex HR, ex senior manager and director and now run my own business I would usually check with an employment lawyer just to make sure there's no comeback. Many law firms now run specialist services for SMEs. In a case which appears cut and dried as this does I'd guess you're looking at a £200 - £300 bill.

I used to consult and recommend ACAS all the time. I no longer do. They made most of their experts redundant and replaced them with call handlers who read off a script.

(and the employee doesn't have to be proven guilty and convicted; the employer just has to have reasonable cause to dismiss)

Aquamania

Opinion wrote: »

It is my business, yet.

I have template documents for Disciplinary and Dismissal Procedure which I will present to the employee this week during their formal disciplinary meeting, and the case is completely cut and shut (charged by police), I just don't have a template for the actual Dismissal for Gross Misconduct.

Opinion wrote: »

Yes- charged with an offence and given a caution.

When were the police appointed judge, jury & executioner of this land? :huh:

Or did you appoint yourself for those roles?

duchy

Since when did charges mean someone was guilty -the police don't decide that- the courts do. If you dismiss someone for a charge they are later acquitted from you are setting yourself up for a heap of trouble. You really should check your legal cover and get some advice.

martinbuckley

What were they charged and subsequently cautioned for?


Does it affect their ability to perform their job?


Did the offence take place when they were on company premises and/or company time?


I'd be asking those questions before you fire them for Gross Misconduct - An office worker cant be fired for being convicted of drink driving, and a driver cant be fired for being convicted of theft, unless the offence took place on company premises and/or company time (ie theft from the employer or drink driving on the way to/from a meeting).

somethingcorporate

Why no contract OP?

Savvy_Sue

paddyrg wrote: »

Whoa a minute! Do you really NEED to go down the route of giving them something they can challenge in court? They've been there less than 2 years, you can drop them for pretty much no reason at all, save all this stress and ACAS etc business.

Personally I think it IS worth doing properly, because if the employee believes there was discrimination at work, it could cause a fair degree of hassle while the OP demonstrates that there was not.

Opinion

Savvy_Sue wrote: »

Personally I think it IS worth doing properly, because if the employee believes there was discrimination at work, it could cause a fair degree of hassle while the OP demonstrates that there was not.

Having spoken to my solicitor I will be doing things properly. I'm not worried about this coming back on me in anyway- the quieter and less fuss for the employee the better, from their point of view. This has given me a kick up the back side with regards to the legal side of things and employment related law that I've been slowly getting round to.

For those that have offered useful, constructive advice I'd like to say thank you very much.

To those that clearly every UK and EU law currently in effect, and yet offer nothing useful, I salute you.

Thread closed.

bris

You don't need a reason as long as it's not discriminatory, just tell him/her they are no longer required and you don't have to even give a reason, 6 months gives the employee no right to challenge.

Contracts are not required in law but without them the employee has all the employment rights offered by law, so whether or not a contract is in place is no concern of anyone else, its actually a disadvantage to the employer.

Prothet_of_Doom

They have no rights, other than you can't sack them because of their race, religion, gender, pregnancy, sexuality, or disability.

They haven't been with you long enough.

Make sure you give them a P60 for last year and a P45 for this year when you fire them.