Faulty used car (third time) now over 6 months

Toxicity

Sorry for the long post. In need of some advice (again) before we scrap this POS and write off a lot of money.

End of November - purchased a second hand car from a dealer (85k miles), advertised as in good condition, we were not made aware of any faults. P/X & cash to purchase.

- 2 weeks later car starts getting stuck in gear, drops into neutral when slowing, basically leaving us stuck at junctions/traffic lights for a few minutes until it decides to select a gear. Got car to local indi, diagnosed fault - needed a new pump at £800. Gave us quote. Called dealer, told them what was up and what it needed, OK we'll flat bed it 30 miles to a gearbox specialist near us. They take it & 2 days later call to say specialist cleaned contacts & its working. Go pick it up and all is fine.

- Christmas Eve (couple of weeks later), take car out, get stuck in 1st gear on a very busy road. Manage to pull into a side street before it drops to neutral and get stuck there diagonally across the entrance. RAC come out & tow us back. Call dealer, who is starting to get agitated, they agree to let us take car to our indi to get new pump fitted, great! They call back, change their minds & decide to flatbed it 30 miles away to original garage. They had the car for 2 weeks over Christmas & new year, call garage & they tell us pump is done for, there's no fixing it, needs a new one (nosht!) call dealer & he says they are sourcing a new pump. Again, great.

Turns out, this 'new' pump cost them £50 from eBay & came off a car with even more mileage than the one we have.

Fast forward to now, we are now passed the 6 month period by about 2 weeks and car has the same problem. Stuck in neutral, can't move it. (After again, getting stuck at a very busy junction, being beeped at, shouted at & almost crashed into - with a 2 year old in the back) Now it is passed the 6 months do we have ANY rights left because the same fault is still present despite their bodged attempt x2 to fix it? Would small claims get us anywhere or will we end up losing & having to pay their fees too?

If it is relevant, we have done less than 1.5k miles since we have had it.

Don't want them to 'fix' it again (and I am confident we will get told to eff off if we call) - I will never trust this car again.

LandyAndy

Hmm. Old cars go wrong sometimes. The dealer fitted a working second hand part that gave you about four months service. You didn't expect them to fit a new pump did you?


I think your only option is to replace the pump again (assuming that is the fault) at your expense. Whether you choose to replace it with a new one or another second hand one is up to you.


What make, model and year of car is it?

Tilt

You havn't passed the 6 month 'rule' at all. The defect was reported 2 weeks after purchase and the same fault still exists.

Basically you have given the seller reasonable opportunity to inspect and rectify of which he hasn't successfully done. As I see it you could still use the SOGA to either pursue the cost of a main dealer repair or reject the car as not being fit for the purpose and not of satisfactory quality.

Obviously it would be for a judge to decide the ultimate outcome but I assume you have all the necessary paperwork to show that the fault existed and that attempts have been made to rectify.

My advice would be to write formally to the seller saying that as far as you are concerned the original fault still exists and insist that they either get it fixed at a main dealer or offer you a full refund.

I further suggest that you seek face to face advice from a consumer specialist solicitor (or CAB) to rubber stamp the above.

Please keep us posted.

arcon5

Really depends on the car, its age and its mileage - ie whether it's faulty or just wear and tear

fivetide

You could - could suggest that you buy the part - a genuine brand new one and they fit it thus paying the labour.

It seems they can at least fit the things and you'd know that the part was a good one.

As said though, depends on the age, miles, price of car etc.

Toxicity

Thanks for the responses.

- Did we expect them to fit a new pump? Yes. During the conversation that took place the second time it broke down we specifically asked for either a NEW (not different) pump fitting or to return the car. We even told them our mechanic strongly suggested a new pump, as recon pumps or breaker pumps often fail again quickly. They were going to let us return it & give us our PX car back at one point, until they realized they had sold it. We didn't pay a discounted price for a car with issues, we paid (too much) for a working car in good condition, which we have not got. Even out of the 6 months we have had it, at least 6 weeks of that the car has been at a garage 30 miles away or stuck on the street unable to move.

- It's a Fiat Stilo Abarth 2004 (I know, I know - sillyspeed - never again) we purchased it knowing it's an old car & it would need things doing to it - all of which have been done. (Brakes, ball joints etc) but I think being sold a car that breaks down after 2 weeks & requires an £890 fix (half the price paid & almost as much as the car is probably worth) is a bit of a pee take. It also wouldn't surprise me if they knew it was busted & did one of their bodge job specials to get it going long enough to sell it. But I can't prove that unfortunately.

- We have the original quote from a Fiat Specialist stating what is needed to fix it, we have a letter from the gear box specialist the dealer used stating a replacement pump the dealer supplied them has been fitted & we have a recent video showing the fault still occuring while stuck on a busy road, which is dated. Unfortunately most of the conversations were done by phone.

I have no idea how a judge would look at this, whether a 1k bill on a 2k car 2 weeks after purchasing it is reasonable because its an old car, or not. Then there's the added issue of their 'fixes' that have kept it going for a few months. Maybe it'd just be easier to take my £150 scrap, move on & never go near a Fiat again.

Tilt

Toxicity wrote: »

Thanks for the responses.

- Did we expect them to fit a new pump? Yes. During the conversation that took place the second time it broke down we specifically asked for either a NEW (not different) pump fitting or to return the car. We even told them our mechanic strongly suggested a new pump, as recon pumps or breaker pumps often fail again quickly. They were going to let us return it & give us our PX car back at one point, until they realized they had sold it. We didn't pay a discounted price for a car with issues, we paid (too much) for a working car in good condition, which we have not got. Even out of the 6 months we have had it, at least 6 weeks of that the car has been at a garage 30 miles away or stuck on the street unable to move.

- It's a Fiat Stilo Abarth 2004 (I know, I know - sillyspeed - never again) we purchased it knowing it's an old car & it would need things doing to it - all of which have been done. (Brakes, ball joints etc) but I think being sold a car that breaks down after 2 weeks & requires an £890 fix (half the price paid & almost as much as the car is probably worth) is a bit of a pee take. It also wouldn't surprise me if they knew it was busted & did one of their bodge job specials to get it going long enough to sell it. But I can't prove that unfortunately.

- We have the original quote from a Fiat Specialist stating what is needed to fix it, we have a letter from the gear box specialist the dealer used stating a replacement pump the dealer supplied them has been fitted & we have a recent video showing the fault still occuring while stuck on a busy road, which is dated. Unfortunately most of the conversations were done by phone.

I have no idea how a judge would look at this, whether a 1k bill on a 2k car 2 weeks after purchasing it is reasonable because its an old car, or not. Then there's the added issue of their 'fixes' that have kept it going for a few months. Maybe it'd just be easier to take my £150 scrap, move on & never go near a Fiat again.

Don't blame Fiat. I'm on my 14th and have never regretted sticking to them.

It's a sellaspeed which is a specialist job and needs doing correctly which if it had of been in the first place, then you wouldn't be having the problem now. Its' up to the seller to know what he is selling and the possible consequences he faces if it goes wrong. If it was dodgy, then he shouldn't have sold it in the first place without saying it had a problem. How much did you pay for it?

Toxicity

It is a lovely car to drive when it is working, but incredibly expensive to fix when it isn't. - which is often.

They gave us £1.5k p/x for our Astra (oh how I miss that car) and we paid £400 cash - far too much I know that now, but it was in lovely condition, apparently had nothing wrong with it & OH fell in love with it.

And yes, we have never taken it to anyone that doesn't know there way around a selespeed. We did tell the dealer the gearbox company probably wouldn't know what to do with it, but they insisted they wanted their local guys to try fix it & not ours.

colino

I think as a reward for retailing such a well known heap of junk you should demand a full refund from the trader. If this the Selespeed going into retreat mode, it needs diagnosed and fixed properly first time by an experienced FIAT hand. All they have done now by fobbing you off (if it always has been the same fault), is incurred (albeit trade) repair costs and still haven't presented a properly working car.
This sounds like a chancer hoping the car would self-repair and you would tire of going back to them.

Tilt

Toxicity wrote: »

It is a lovely car to drive when it is working, but incredibly expensive to fix when it isn't. - which is often.

They gave us £1.5k p/x for our Astra (oh how I miss that car) and we paid £400 cash - far too much I know that now, but it was in lovely condition, apparently had nothing wrong with it & OH fell in love with it.

And yes, we have never taken it to anyone that doesn't know there way around a selespeed. We did tell the dealer the gearbox company probably wouldn't know what to do with it, but they insisted they wanted their local guys to try fix it & not ours.

If it had been in tip top condition with FSH, that would of been about right from a decent second hand dealer.

But me thinks that the seller knew that all was not well and knew very little about this kind of transmission. It was relatively a new thing about 10 years ago and I believe the Stilo Abarth was one of the first cars it was fitted to. But as previously said, it is a job for a specialist when it goes wrong and in this case, it should of been properly sorted BEFORE you bought it if it was being described as in good condition.

I suggest you follow my previous advice.

AdrianC

Tilt wrote: »

But me thinks that the seller knew that all was not well and knew very little about this kind of transmission. It was relatively a new thing about 10 years ago and I believe the Stilo Abarth was one of the first cars it was fitted to.

Selespeed was launched in '99, and was used widely across Fiat group cars. It has long had an _abysmal_ reputation for reliability.