UKPC - Parking Fine - Advice Please

Obj

In Febuary my girlfriend recieved a parking ticket from UKPC because she parked in a loading bay at her workplace. Normally she wouldn't dispute the ticket but she had previously been told by the UKPC attendant that she'd be ok to park there. Assuming it would be ok to do so again, she parked in the loading bay a second time. This time she received a ticket. The windscreen ticket was naturally followed a week or so later by a letter in the post. The basic timeline is as follows (apologies, I don't have specific dates to hand):


She receives postal notification of the fine
Responds stating that she had been told she could park there on a previous occasion
Receives response stating that UKPC had checked with their employees who had denied saying this and therefore the "fine" stands.
She then replied asking for proof that they spoke to the employees, and assumed this would give her an extra 35 days leeway before having to pay the fine.
She never hears back from UKPC.
She has now received a letter from DRP stating she owes £160 and to pay by the end of the month.


At this stage she is also outside of the 28 day appeal period to POPLA.


Today she contacted UKPC who have said it is out of their hands as the matter is with DRP.
She then contacted DRP who asked how she wanted to pay, before offering a one-time 20% discount. She didn't pay them.
She also spoke to Citizens Advice who have said basically she can either pay it or she can ignore it.


She is very very frightened that she is going to end up having to pay a large sum of money or being taken to court, and is very close to just paying the £160. Both myself and her mother are telling her not to pay, but both her sister and father think she should (purely to end the grief and worry she is feeling).


Unfortunately I found the forum too late to go though the procedure outlined in the Newbie thread from the get go, and we now find ourselves in a rather horrible situation of not really knowing what to do.


I have been through the forums and think the best course of action is to send a modified version of the first appeal letter from the Newbie thread to UKPC (stating that 'the driver' had been told previously that they could park there, and that they had not responded to her request for proof that UKPC had spoken to their employees). Also sending a copy of Daisy's debt collector letter to DRP stating she will be contesting the charge. But I am new to this and really don't know if that is the right approach at this point.


All this is assuming she hasn't got herself into a corner by already essentially admitting the offence and entering into correspondence.


I would really appreciate peoples thoughts and advice on this, as she is really struggling to hold it together at the moment, and I don't want her to pay something this extreme when money is very tight for her unless she absolutely has to.


Many thanks in advance

HO87

Firstly, your girlfriend has committed no offence and what she has is not a fine. No private company can "fine" anyone.

Secondly, DR+ are simple debt collectors and have as much power at law to enforce a debt as you or I or indeed your girlfriend. That boils down to asking for the money that is alleged to be owed to be paid. They rely on being able to frighten people into paying who don't understand how they work and will use threats of all manner of doom and gloom to get at the money. As debt collectors they will only be paid if they collect the debt.

They can be dealt with by writing a short letter:

Dear Sirs

<Quote their reference>

I refer to the above which alleges that money is owed to UK Parking Control Ltd. The debt has been and is denied. You should now refer the matter back to your clients.

Any further communication from you will be regarded as harassment.

Yours faithfully

Having disposed of the debt collectors we can concentrate on the UKPC issue.

In their letter of reply to your girlfriend's challenge was a POPLA reference number and details of how to appeal or an appeal form included?

fisherjim

Obj, follow HO87's advice UKPC are scammers, they will not have spoken to your girlfriend's employers all they want is money, and their attendants just want to rack up their bonus.
Whatever she does she should not pay them!

Stroma

It's a bit difficult for ukpc to claim £160 in court, the reason is that they never go there, they are just trying to scare you into paying, the same for DR+ who cannot take anyone to court as the debt is not even theirs!

UKPC has not contacted your employer's, to do so on this will probably breach the dpa, so they are basically lying! Which they do a lot! And this company left about a million images open to the public of vehicles and their employees who was abusing their equipment by taking pictures of a pig in a basket amongst other things.

It never ceases to amaze why people get so stressed with crap from debt collectors, if they were Debt Recovery (Nigeria) + would you that be taken as seriously?

Obj

First up, thank you all for your responses. It will help her feel more comfortable about the situation I am sure.

One quick note, my reference in my first post was to employees of UKPC, (as in the Parking Attendants) not my girlfriends employers.

I will encourage her to send off the letter to DRP tonight.

HO87 wrote: »

In their letter of reply to your girlfriend's challenge was a POPLA reference number and details of how to appeal or an appeal form included?

She says that she does have a POPLA reference number yes.

HO87

@Obj - on what date was that issued?

Redx

as above, you can all ignore the debt collectors and do not pay them , even if it went to small claims court it could be less to pay and at most slightly more, assuming a judge found in their favour , which UKPC or the landowner are unlikely to do

as far as the popla code is concerned, this can be checked using the parking cowboys checker in the NEWBIES thread, I assume you have done this and the code has exceeded the 28 day limit (meaning its run out and no longer valid)

if its no longer valid, that is a shame as it could have been used to easily win this at popla, there are no second chances and they dont accept late appeals unless there were extremely mitigating circumstances, like a close bereavement or very severe accident etc (I assume there isnt here, that this popla code was ignored)

so what can you do ?

as far as DR+ , ignore them as they have no power , no more than me or any responder here has

UKPC ? - they could take you to court , but that is very unlikely (never say never though) - this can happen any time over the next 6 years under small claims laws , so no quick fix , you wait it out

the landowner ? - the landowner can cancel the charge as they are the only one with any real power under the law , they employed the PPC in the first place (or the managing agent did)

so all you can really do is try to get the landowner to cancel the charge

I appreciate its all in the NEWBIES thread but am spelling it out in simple terms for you any anyone else that reads this. In future use the popla codes, its easier that way

when checking any future paperwork, if an LBC or court papers came from northampton or salford, do not ignore them - come back here for advice on dealing with them

Obj

HO87 wrote: »

@Obj - on what date was that issued?

15/02/2014 (expired April 7th)

Redx wrote: »

as above, you can all ignore the debt collectors and do not pay them , even if it went to small claims court it could be less to pay and at most slightly more, assuming a judge found in their favour , which UKPC or the landowner are unlikely to do

as far as the popla code is concerned, this can be checked using the parking cowboys checker in the NEWBIES thread, I assume you have done this and the code has exceeded the 28 day limit (meaning its run out and no longer valid)

if its no longer valid, that is a shame as it could have been used to easily win this at popla, there are no second chances and they dont accept late appeals unless there were extremely mitigating circumstances, like a close bereavement or very severe accident etc (I assume there isnt here, that this popla code was ignored)

Yeah I have looked at that and it has expired. However, you mention a close bereavement as possibly being an extenuating circumstance. Sadly my Mum died 3 days (18th Feb) after the rejection letter was issued, and she was close to my girlfriend - would this perhaps be good grounds to apply based on mitigating circumstances?

Once again thank you both for the responses.

Coupon-mad

15/02/2014 ... it has expired. However, you mention a close bereavement as possibly being an extenuating circumstance. Sadly my Mum died 3 days (18th Feb) after the rejection letter was issued, and she was close to my girlfriend - would this perhaps be good grounds to apply based on mitigating circumstances?

Yep, send the POPLA appeal by 1st class post tomorrow with a covering letter stating (with dates) why it was slightly delayed and that you (well in fact, the appellant) understands that POPLA may consider it under the difficult circumstances even though it is past 28 days. The reason I say 'post it' rather than do it online is that I think you may get it looked at. Whereas an online one may not even be read, just kicked out as 'too late' by a clerk looking purely at the code date. You need to download a POPLA form from the POPLA or BPA website if UKPC didn't attach a hard copy.

Loads of example POPLA appeals linked in the NEWBIES thread post #3 'How to win at POPLA' hyperlink. PLEASE DO NOT DELAY THIS, JUST DO IT, OUR POPLA APPEALS WIN EVERY TIME (not that UKPC do court, because they don't only when they were taken there!). This is not a firm to pay £1.60 to, let alone £160!

If POPLA reject it as 'too late' then email and ask for the Lead Adjudicator to review the matter. By the way, the family would need their heads examining if they want her to pay this scam. There are ENDLESS threads here about people laughing at the whole DRP/Zenith letter chain - no-one PAYS!


P.S. Genuinely sorry to read the very sad news about your Mum. I lost my parents a few years ago and am no stranger to bereavement.

Obj

Coupon-mad wrote: »

P.S. Genuinely sorry to read the very sad news about your Mum. I lost my parents a few years ago and am no stranger to bereavement.

Many thanks, it's been a hard few months, you can't ever be prepared for something like that can you.


I've now gotten the documents in hand, and the date of rejection was actually 10th March (I am guessing that my girlfriend confused the dates of the offence and the rejection). The 15th Feb was the date of the actual fine being issued.


I am looking at the POPLA examples now. Thank you


To clarify we should continue and send a letter to DRP stating that we are disputing the charge as well as the appeal to POPLA?


Thanks again.

Coupon-mad

No need to spend even a second responding to DRP unless you want to send a one-liner but only after POPLA have agreed to consider it. Personally I would concentrate on getting a POPLA appeal posted in the morning that has the usual winning points (no GPEOL and no Standing/landowner authority, dodgy signage, no contract with driver), with a heartfelt covering letter. All securely stapled together with the 10 digit POPLA code on EVERY page and with a POPLA form (tick all boxes of appeal grounds except 'stolen car'). Make sure your covering letter is the top thing (when I say 'your' I mean the registered keeper who is the person appealing).