Direct Debit Indemnity and Paypal

Buzby

Yawn!

You still spouting this misinformation Grumbler? No change there.

An intermediary negates the protection and is well known (but apparently not by you) and as the rules have not changed, you cannot seek a reversal from a bank unless they are the beneficiary - which PP are not.

Why not advise simonsays of his 'RAC and others' of his mistake?!

I'd concentrate more on watching the OPs credit score being fried for 5 years by PP.

Hazzanet

Buzby wrote: »

The bank is correct, PayPal is an intermediary,

As for the RAC being exempt from the Guarantee, that is nonsense - as they are a standard merchant and not a funds processor.

"Intermediaries" are not exempt from the DD Guarantee and indemnity claims can be raised by the paying banks against them.

If the dispute falls within the terms of the guarantee (amount, collection date etc) then it can be reclaimed using the DD Guarantee; if the DD Guarantee is used fraudulently (i.e. the claim's made due to a contract dispute, shoddy goods etc) then the intermediary can go back to the payer asking for the money back and request that they raise the issue directly with the contracted party.

Hazzanet

Also PayPal show you the DD Guarantee at signup:

grumbler

Buzby wrote: »

Yawn!

You still spouting this misinformation Grumbler?

Well, I thought it was you, and I stick to my guns.
Is "Yawn!" your best evidence to back your apparently correct information?
Do you not confuse DD guarantee with CCA s75 that (arguably) does exclude intermediaries, but has nothing to do with the DDs?

I'd concentrate more on watching the OPs credit score being fried for 5 years by PP.

I can be wrong here, but I don't think that PP (any payment processor / e-wallet) is a company that can report to CRAs and fry files.

OhReally_2

Shortie4 wrote: »

I have just been told by my bank that the Direct Debit indemnity doesn't apply to Paypal and that even though they have taken a duplicate direct be debit from my account leaving me without any money for the Easter weekend there is nothing that they can do about it, is this true?

Well, since you ask, and bearing in mind this was only your second ever post under this user id, and that you created it on the morning of not only a bank holiday (hint), but even before 9am, I'd have to say your post is untrue.

Am I right? Do I get a prize? :cool:

pvt

Buzby wrote: »

An intermediary negates the protection and is well known (but apparently not by you) and as the rules have not changed, you cannot seek a reversal from a bank unless they are the beneficiary - which PP are not.

??


PayPal aren't an intermediary here, they are the recipient of the DD. It is no concern of the OP's bank what PayPal do with the money they draw from the OP's account by direct debit - just that PayPal drew it and the OP says it is wrong.


I think you're confusing yourself with S75 liability, where PayPal's role between the buyer and seller is as an intermediary.


If you believe PayPal are an intermediary in the issue being discussed her, then please produce some evidence that the DD guarantee does not apply.


There's nothing more cringeworthy than seeing someone post incorrect information whilst slagging off another poster who has actually correctly stated the case - Suggest you probably need to offer Grumbler a humiliating apology.

MamaMoo_2

Buzby wrote: »

Yawn!

You still spouting this misinformation Grumbler? No change there.

An intermediary negates the protection and is well known (but apparently not by you) and as the rules have not changed, you cannot seek a reversal from a bank unless they are the beneficiary - which PP are not.

Why not advise simonsays of his 'RAC and others' of his mistake?!

I'd concentrate more on watching the OPs credit score being fried for 5 years by PP.

The DD guarantee, in full

The Guarantee is offered by all banks and building societies that accept instructions to pay Direct Debits
If there are any changes to the amount, date or frequency of your Direct Debit the organisation will notify you (normally 10 working days) in advance of your account being debited or as otherwise agreed. If you request the organisation to collect a payment, confirmation of the amount and date will be given to you at the time of the request
If an error is made in the payment of your Direct Debit, by the organisation or your bank or building society, you are entitled to a full and immediate refund of the amount paid from your bank or building society
If you receive a refund you are not entitled to, you must pay it back when the organisation asks you to
You can cancel a Direct Debit at any time by simply contacting your bank or building society. Written confirmation may be required. Please also notify the organisation.

Please note the lack of exclusions, additional T&Cs, footnotes etc.
When PayPal take a DD, it's often because they have paid the seller on your behalf and you now owe them the money (at least, when they take a DD from me, this is why, as I have chosen to pay a small amount from my bank account. Not to be confused with an e-cheque). Therefore, in this case, PayPal are not an intermediary, they are the company you are paying and the same company that you owe the money to.
Irrelevant, anyway, as even if they are an intermediary they still have to abide by the direct debit guarantee, and as they have made a mistake then the OP has every right to invoke the guarantee and raise an indemnity.

I think you may be getting confused with certain banks/CC providers rejecting chargeback and S75 claims on the basis that they paid PayPal who are an intermediary, and as PayPal did their job then then whatever happens with the third party seller is irrelevant.

Unfortunately, the direct debit guarantee is perfectly clear with regards to what it covers, and the OP's issue (payment mistakenly taken twice) is covered.

grumbler

Why is it 'unfortunately', not 'fortunately'?

MamaMoo_2

grumbler wrote: »

Why is it 'unfortunately', not 'fortunately'?

Unfortunately for Buzby's argument