Asbestos- Turning a blind eye?

stebiz

I live in a traditional 3 bed Semi 1930's era. I have for a number of years. Recently I decided to get a loft conversion and also take the opportunity to do a full revamp of the property. I moved out along with all our belongings for 6 months.

Upstairs was artexed and I also saw some 'dodgy' stuff in the loft so decided on an asbestos report on first floor and loft.

Artex was fairly new - late 1980's and was fine and tested negative for asbestos. So was lino and all the other tests proved okay too.

Everywhere has since been demolished and renewed. After a few months of having all ceilings upstairs removed etc and all new walls, bathrooms etc etc we are now downstairs.

Just had another report downstairs and it has proven positive for asbestos in a couple of areas (obviously done at different times) so here lay my dilemma. All my ceilings are being pulled down (lathe and plaster with cracking) and walls rendered and plastered. Now the plasterer was happy to pull all this down and skip. He said very few have it tested and what you don't know doesn't hurt.

Now I can't leave it in situ because of works required and I'm not boarding over or anything as I'm here for a good few years hopefully.

How many do turn a blind eye to all this asbestos m'larky. Latest stats say that approx 1 in 15,000 die from exposure. Hardly an epidemic but at the same time not a nice way to die either. It is the white asbestos and not the more serious brown or blue and is also very low grade in percentage terms.

Who rips or lino, floor tiles, putty, artex, insulation boards, soffits, corrugated sheets without either knowing or caring? My cost is adding about 1.5k to my bill but will be cleaned properly and air tested afterwards.

Thoughts?

wallbash

Now the plasterer was happy to pull all this down and skip.

Latest stats say that approx 1 in 15,000 die from exposure

And I bet the vast majority of them are those who remove blue asbestos every day .

Too many scare stories go unchallenged, too many people have climbed on the health and safety gravy train.
I would not cut up anything and create dust , but apart from that I would just get on with the job. ( and if truth be told ... have done)

MisterBaxter

How many DIYers ever bother checking for asbestos before they start ripping out all manner of potentially hazardous materials. Now that you know you have the dilemma of do you do it properly or carry on as though you were ignorant to the fact.

If you decide to proceed get a proper dust-mask which is always a good idea when stripping out, damp down what you can and double bag/seal everything that you know is asbestos.

The big problem would be if you got caught and it came out that you knew that you removing and disposing of asbestos and hadn't done it properly. Although ignorance is never a defence you wouldn't even be able to try and claim ignorance.

stebiz

MisterBaxter wrote: »

How many DIYers ever bother checking for asbestos before they start ripping out all manner of potentially hazardous materials. Now that you know you have the dilemma of do you do it properly or carry on as though you were ignorant to the fact.

If you decide to proceed get a proper dust-mask which is always a good idea when stripping out, damp down what you can and double bag/seal everything that you know is asbestos.

The big problem would be if you got caught and it came out that you knew that you removing and disposing of asbestos and hadn't done it properly. Although ignorance is never a defence you wouldn't even be able to try and claim ignorance.

Removing artex with asbetos in it isn't licensed work and can be done by anybody. Obviously it would need disposing of correctly.

Like I said it is costing 1.5k to get somebody in. That isn't because I wouldn't do it myself but if I'm honest I'm not really a DIY'er. I earn decent money doing my job which I'm good at and leave all the building work to the professionals. It just happens that I'll be paying this to an asbestos removal company but 1.5k against the 50k project I'm doing isn't a lot iin the scheme of things.

Does make me wonder though how many take up lino, tiles, soffits etc etc and don't even think about it. Like you say they can claim ignorance. I wonder if ignorance is bliss at times.

trailingspouse

We had asbestos in our garage ceiling (garage is under the house). We knew nothing about it until having the place re-wired - it was the electrician who spotted it and (reasonably enough) said they wouldn't be able to work on the garage while it was in place. They started elsewhere in the house and I arranged for it to be professionally removed - cost £1000 + VAT.

Once I knew it was there, I had to do something about it - and I wouldn't have contemplated doing anything other than having it removed by the experts.

stebiz

trailingspouse wrote: »

We had asbestos in our garage ceiling (garage is under the house). We knew nothing about it until having the place re-wired - it was the electrician who spotted it and (reasonably enough) said they wouldn't be able to work on the garage while it was in place. They started elsewhere in the house and I arranged for it to be professionally removed - cost £1000 + VAT.

Once I knew it was there, I had to do something about it - and I wouldn't have contemplated doing anything other than having it removed by the experts.

I'd say you did the right thing. Just makes you wonder though for those DIY'ers out there who, without realizing, would have taken the ceiling down themselves.

Still hard to get my head around really.

110,000 die from smoking each year
3,000 from car accidents
and yet 'only' 4,000 from Mesothelioma (Asbestos Cancer)

Now bearing in mind it was in everything and every one of us will have breathed in the fibres in one way or another, be it at school, in the library, changing brakes, artex,lino, tiles, farm sheds, irons, putty, fires........the list is endless it really makes you wonder if it is just hysteria.

Please don't get me wrong. I'm sitting on the fence on this one and laws are there to be followed. In the meantime I'm taking my responsibility seriously and having it moved professionally all be it there is only 'traces' in the artex. But I'm fortunate. I'm not living in the property and mine won't cost too much to get it done.

Now my wife is different. Personally she'd rather save the cash and take it down herself...........which she won't be doing I can assure you.

mymedi

As far as I know (and I did look at research on asbestos types), white asbestos is biodegradable, so chucking it is no big deal. Also, keep in mind that millions of tons of white asbestos every year are still used everywhere for this very reason. Including US & Europe.

The reason why generally it's not advisable to deal with asbestos yourself (rather than inviting specialists), other than the "gravy train", is that most people don't know what proper protection to use and don't bother to check if it's white or blue/brown asbestos (which really is dangerous). If you've had it checked and it's white, no big deal.

Biggles

stebiz wrote: »

Now the plasterer was happy to pull all this down and skip.

I know how he feels; it always puts a spring in my step when I finish a job.

Niv

mymedi wrote: »

white asbestos is biodegradable, .

This is nonsense. It is not biodegradable.

trailingspouse

Interestingly, the guy who came to take a sample for testing just cut a bit off with a penknife - no protective clothing/mask at all. Testing confirmed that it was white, but when the guys came to actually remove it they wore all the gear.

AND THEY HOOVERED THE GARAGE WHEN THEY'D FINISHED.

BlueC

stebiz wrote: »

Who rips or lino, floor tiles, putty, artex, insulation boards, soffits, corrugated sheets without either knowing or caring? My cost is adding about 1.5k to my bill but will be cleaned properly and air tested afterwards.

Thoughts?

Our property had asbestos ceilings. We had it tested, confirmed it was white, and were told by the expert that we can remove it safely ourselves with a bit of care and it was nothing to worry about. He basically said a whole industry has been built around health scare stories and fear of being sued, but that white asbestos in domestic properties can be safely removed by the occupiers. In commercial properties the owners would be so worried about being sued they would take the hit of paying a specialist company to remove it.

We bought the appropriate PPE (full white suits, masks, etc) and removed it all ourselves. Double bagged it and took it to our local council asbestos disposal service.