New request for personal info from Selftrade

SnowMan

An article about this is on the telegraph website this morning

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/savings/10788369/Savers-must-answer-intrusive-questions-to-get-money.html

And this has appeared on the investor's chronicle website in the past few days

http://www.investorschronicle.co.uk/2014/04/25/your-money/financial-planning/selftrade-attempts-to-freeze-client-assets-unfairly-mfmgMMl6zBmJfUIGliYhgK/article.html

spinbuster

The Selftrade issue falls within the scope of the EU third money-laundering directive which was given effect in the United Kingdom by the Money Laundering Regulations 2007.

Since the introduction of the Money Laundering Regulations 2007 anyone wishing to transfer money through the accounts of financial institutions and professionals can be asked to provide “ proof of innocent acquisition of funds ”. The old legal principle “innocent until proven guilty” no longer applies. Basically, every solicitor, accountant, banker etc. is now acting as an unpaid state policeman in addition to providing the service their clients pay for. Also, should any of these proxy policemen suspect money laundering is taking place, they are required to notify the authorities without informing their client. They face criminal sanction if they are deemed to have knowingly or unknowingly laundered funds through their accounts or have tipped off their client. These extra unpaid duties required of them by government increase their cost of doing business.
(See The Law Society’s checklist on how to become an unpaid state policeman:- http://www.lawsociety.org.uk/advice/practice-notes/aml/money-laundering-warning-signs)

Are the regulations counterproductive and do they reduce security?

Large amounts of Sensitive Confidential ID information including quality copies of passports, bank statements, national insurance numbers etc. have been gathered and are now sitting in professionals’ files nationwide at risk of misuse i.e. leakage to criminals and terrorists.
The anti tip-off rule could be totally ineffective as withholding service e.g. freezing an account or refusing to complete a conveyance etc. is, in effect, tipping them off. Would a good intelligence/security service operate in this way?
Also are some professionals and financial institutions taking advantage of the regulations to demand more personal information than is required i.e. phishing?
(See more regarding Selftrade at: http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/f919cace-ca12-11e3-ac05-00144feabdc0.html?siteedition=uk#axzz2zj1JC8Si )

Double Standards?

Ordinary people and professionals are subject to criminal sanction but Banks and Financial Institutions just get fined in a continuing climate of light regulation.
Ominously, recent actions against UK institutions appear to have been initiated mainly by oversight authorities in the USA forcing the UK reluctantly into late action.
(See:- “Notable cases” at Wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Money_laundering

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/banksandfinance/9413299/HSBC-money-laundering-where-was-the-regulator.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/banksandfinance/9939463/Argentina-charges-HSBC-with-alleged-money-laundering.html

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/finance/ianmcowie/100011790/tax-amnesties-turn-hmrc-into-biggest-money-laundering-operation-in-history/ )

Also the rich, especially the foreign rich, appear to have acquired a certain immunity.
See http://rowans-blog.blogspot.co.uk/2013/04/russian-money-laundering-in-london.html
This issue has also been recently covered, but less provocatively, by the BBC.

(See Lord Jopling’s request for change here :- http://www.bigbrotherwatch.org.uk/home/2009/12/your-financial-transactions-are-far-from-private.html )

JohnnyRow

Money box broadcast an article on Saturday no response from Selftrade which made it uninformative.
As a Selftrade client I find the whole exercise a case study of 'how to antagonise your customers'. Time to move on I say, but where?

Chordeiles

SnowMan wrote: »

And this has appeared on the investor's chronicle website in the past few days

http://www.investorschronicle.co.uk/2014/04/25/your-money/financial-planning/selftrade-attempts-to-freeze-client-assets-unfairly-mfmgMMl6zBmJfUIGliYhgK/article.html

Also a few column-inches in Friday's Investors Chronicle, which isn't a word-for-word repeat of the article on the IC website. It points out that Selftrade have been closed to new business since January 2013 (from reading the forums I had previously thought this situation applied since Jan 2014).

This actually predates the new advice on applying the money laundering regulations (April 2013), so if this is true then it seems to me that Selftrade are a business in a deep mess. I feel about as comfortable with them as I would with Iceland or Northern Rock !

Could it be that Selftrade's mess came about because they had become a favourite place for the bad boys to launder money ?

spinbuster

Media comments over the weekend appear to confirm that Seltrade is currently the only execution only dealer requesting additional personal information beyond the requirements of the regulator.
Perhaps the hidden objective of the exercise is to increase profits by flushing out those customers with insufficient trading activity?

Chordeiles

As I said before, I didn't see the notorious intrusive questionnaire - yet.

But I have been struggling to log in to my account since Friday, this morning I tried a different browser and this time I saw a clear message that my account was "locked" and I should call customer services.

So I did that, and was told my account had been moved to "dormant" after 18 months of inactivity. A warning that this was about to happen would really have been appreciated !

To unlock the account they need (you guessed it) personal information. Called "ID" for this purpose. All 3 of the following (emailed scans acceptable) were asked for:

1. A Utility bill from last three months
2. A bank statement from the linked bank account
3. Passport or drivers licence

There is a danger of impossibility with the first two, as everyone is encouraged to use paperless systems these days. Even if your utility bills are still paper they now tend to come every six months, which makes the "last 3 months" insistence unreasonable (by chance my water bill is out of step with the gas and electricity and is recent). And though I usually download my bank statement as a spreadsheet (with no "ID" on it), after some searching on my bank's website I discovered that a version much like a printed statement can be got.

The Selftrade man indicated there was some degree of flexibility on these items, except for the bank statement. And with my bank statement they can see a whole lot of my "private" transactions (that I would not have normally chosen to share with them), e.g. dividends paid from my own company - that should serve to mark me as a potential money-launderer ;-)

To be fair they were reasonably helpful. Having not logged on for ages what I wanted most was my missing statements, and he promised to send paper copies free of charge.

This still fits with my theory that they are trying to drive away (certain ?) customers. I have about £75,000 with them (of course I can't see the exact amount !) but as you can see I haven't traded much in the last 2 years. That was about to change, but the only deals that will now go through Selftrade are those sales that will serve to minimise my exit charges.

Archi_Bald

Chordeiles wrote: »

And with my bank statement they can see a whole lot of my "private" transactions (that I would not have normally chosen to share with them), e.g. dividends paid from my own company - that should serve to mark me as a potential money-launderer ;-)

Just blank out the transactions on your bank statement. All they need to see is your address, your sort code and account number, and the statement date. They have no justification for snooping into your banking transactions.

Chordeiles

Archi_Bald wrote: »

They have no justification for snooping into your banking transactions.

Agreed. But then do they have any justification for the questions on "the questionnaire" ? Or for locking my account because I didn't log in for a while ?

Nipper_55

This blatant blackmailing by S/T and the forcing by HMRC to make one human being inform on another, in secret, is reminiscent of the Gestapo during the 1930s and the East German Stasi secret police after the war.
My father, together with thousands of others, fought and died in great pain,( watched by my mother and me,) because he volunteered to try and prevent this wickedness etc. spreading throughout the world and especially not to the UK. They seemed to have all died in vain as low grade cheap politicians ( not one can be classed as a statesman ) have obviously allowed this to happen and have successfully removed the 'Great' from Great Britain.
Far easier for HMRC and MPs to gain Brownie points by attacking many of us innocent 'small fry' than taking the trouble to find the large tax dodgers and those that money launder to the tune of many millions of pounds. That's far too much trouble and hard work !!
I also do not know if either a neighbour of mine or a relative works for S/T and will open my envelope. Do you know who will open yours and note your figures for future use ? So much for security !
I suggest that we all write to our own MP and tell him or her what we think about the way in which we are being treated !

spinbuster

I have already written to my MP about this.
I will be voting for UKIP at the coming election of MEPs.