A Money Making Experiment - Feedback and Active Involvement Welcome

geordie_joe

c.ford wrote: »

IDs are stored in a database until a user loads a web page. Until that point, the id doesn't exist at all.

Yes but it would be very easy to write a script to show if ads on a page are yours, or not.

In fact you probably wouldn't need to write it, there are many browser / blog plugins, javascript and php scripts which turn "Follow" and "Nofollow" links a different colour. You could adapt one to find your id in an add link instead of "nofollow".

c.ford

geordie_joe wrote: »

Yes but it would be very easy to write a script to show if ads on a page are yours, or not.

In fact you probably wouldn't need to write it, there are many browser / blog plugins, javascript and php scripts which turn "Follow" and "Nofollow" links a different colour. You could adapt one to find your id in an add link instead of "nofollow".

Imagine how many times you might have to reload the page to even get your ID to be loaded though. Its a hell of a lot of work. You could be waiting for a couple of thousand reloads before you get one flash up. Then once that's done, you have to start again! Even if you decided to click the ad multiple times, Google has thresholds for that kind of behaviour.

Nice thinking though Geordie Joe, very devious lol

Flyonthewall

c.ford wrote: »

Granted but if you aren't willing to use your publisher ID on a site that offers you free publishing, what's the point in having a publisher account at all?

I use my ID on sites that I have full control over. I choose where I want the ads, they're on my pages, I know the content on my pages etc. I'm not giving my ID to someone I don't know who could be placing my ID on any random page about who knows what.

You seem to be missing the main point. I like having my google account and it could be a good source of income now and in the future and if one little thing goes wrong that's it. The account would be gone for good. So based on that I like to have control over my ID and the ads, not rely on someone else who couldn't care less what happens to my account.

I can't and won't allow a few bad eggs to spoil the show.

That's good but it doesn't mean they won't try. It only takes one person to slip through the system and monitoring and someone could lose their google account.

I have absolutely no reason to lie to you, and if you had joined my site from the wild I would be more than happy to show you the system in place. I know there are hundreds of places I could put this thread and spam the hell out of it, but I chose to come here because I wanted real opinions and input, rather than a place to advertise.

Actually you have ever reason to lie because you need people like us to join your site so you can make money and pretending to be genuine, want advice, be friendly and so on is the perfect way to persuade people to join. You may not have spammed or broken any rules or posted any links or whatever and I am not saying you are lying - I don't think you are - but none of us know you. No one on the site knows you and no one on the site is going to know how happy you'd be to show them the system.

You need a way to show people on the site that they can trust using the site. It's just a point to remember - they don't know you. They won't be basing their trust of a site on what you claim it is, but based on what they can see and experience on the site.

Clearly the one thing that I or Google can't help you with is how much trust you place in a site. As anyone would say "If it feels wrong, it probably is". You have to follow your instinct, just as I did when I opened this thread. If your gut feeling was to stay away from my site, then so be it. I've found that human capital can be asset and liability rolled into one, but one thing remains constant - there's always someone new.

There are various ways you could change things. Have your own payout system (so you get 100% from ads and then send a percentage of that to the members) or you just place ads on the person whose question it is (saving abuse from others if your ID is on their question and they don't know the system) or make it all points and have a reward section (so people don't instantly see cash and get greedy).

I was all for the site and getting some money for that until the point when I realised it meant risking my own google account.

Thing is I'd be someone who would use the site as intended and I'd be a regular active member, happy to help out, but even if I trust the site and would be happy to give my ID I don't trust all other people to do the same and use the site properly.

The site is your business. You're the one who has to run it, you have the control. If the risk is all yours it's more of a guarantee you'll do whatever to protect it and as a member I don't have to worry (which I shouldn't have to). However, you're passing most of the risk onto the members and they can't control any of it.

Flyonthewall

c.ford wrote: »

Imagine how many times you might have to reload the page to even get your ID to be loaded though. Its a hell of a lot of work. You could be waiting for a couple of thousand reloads before you get one flash up. Then once that's done, you have to start again! Even if you decided to click the ad multiple times, Google has thresholds for that kind of behaviour.

Nice thinking though Geordie Joe, very devious lol

It's not much work if a script does it. It's also far less work when there's very few members. It's not like some guy is sitting there clicking refresh for 24 hours a day on a site with hundreds of thousands of members in the hope that his ID will come up so he can click it and gain some money.

You made a key point there though - google has thresholds for that kind of behaviour. Yeah, they don't like that and they will ban accounts. So if they do that on an ID that's yours then you're in trouble.

It may not get them money but that doesn't mean they won't do it. It's the challenge or the fun of seeing whether they can do it and what affect it has. There doesn't need to be any other reason other than because they can.

c.ford

Flyonthewall wrote: »

I use my ID on sites that I have full control over. I choose where I want the ads, they're on my pages, I know the content on my pages etc. I'm not giving my ID to someone I don't know who could be placing my ID on any random page about who knows what.

Fair enough, but members always have some idea of what their ID is being associated with as the site is fully categorized and doesn't deal with taboo themes.

Flyonthewall wrote: »

You seem to be missing the main point. I like having my google account and it could be a good source of income now and in the future and if one little thing goes wrong that's it. The account would be gone for good. So based on that I like to have control over my ID and the ads, not rely on someone else who couldn't care less what happens to my account.

I'm not trying to make you join my site, lets be clear on that. What you do is your choice. As I said at the beginning of the thread, active involvement and feedback is welcome, but I will never try and make people do anything they don't want to.

Flyonthewall wrote: »

That's good but it doesn't mean they won't try. It only takes one person to slip through the system and monitoring and someone could lose their google account.

Flyonthewall wrote: »

Actually you have ever reason to lie because you need people like us to join your site so you can make money and pretending to be genuine, want advice, be friendly and so on is the perfect way to persuade people to join. You may not have spammed or broken any rules or posted any links or whatever and I am not saying you are lying - I don't think you are - but none of us know you. No one on the site knows you and no one on the site is going to know how happy you'd be to show them the system.

Granted. I never thought of it from that perspective.

Flyonthewall wrote: »

You need a way to show people on the site that they can trust using the site. It's just a point to remember - they don't know you. They won't be basing their trust of a site on what you claim it is, but based on what they can see and experience on the site.

This is where the other revenue streams come in. There will be other ways to see that the site is genuine. Like filling out surveys, testing products, giving opinions, watching videos, doing competitions to win vouchers and points to name but a few of the upcoming features.

Flyonthewall wrote: »

There are various ways you could change things. Have your own payout system (so you get 100% from ads and then send a percentage of that to the members) or you just place ads on the person whose question it is (saving abuse from others if your ID is on their question and they don't know the system) or make it all points and have a reward section (so people don't instantly see cash and get greedy).

Our own payout system is something that I will invest heavily in (for users and my peace of mind). For that, I don't want something out of the box. But the results have to show thats its a worthwhile endeavour before I move to that.

Flyonthewall wrote: »

I was all for the site and getting some money for that until the point when I realised it meant risking my own google account.

See above about different income streams.

Flyonthewall wrote: »

Thing is I'd be someone who would use the site as intended and I'd be a regular active member, happy to help out, but even if I trust the site and would be happy to give my ID I don't trust all other people to do the same and use the site properly.

The site is your business. You're the one who has to run it, you have the control. If the risk is all yours it's more of a guarantee you'll do whatever to protect it and as a member I don't have to worry (which I shouldn't have to). However, you're passing most of the risk onto the members and they can't control any of it.

One thing has struck me here, and it has actually made me push back my rollout date by a month or so. It seems that people are very possessive over their G accounts. Myself, I never have been, but then I have never seen it as the be all and end all.

I think I am going to implement some of the other features first and then offer the Google publishing as an option on top of whats available in the form of surveys and vouchers etc.

Thanks Flyonthewall, you've probably done me a big favour there!

geordie_joe

c.ford wrote: »

Imagine how many times you might have to reload the page to even get your ID to be loaded though.

Only three. Out of ten times your add is shown 2.5 times and the other persons is shown 7.5 times. So three clicks will guarantee that the users add is shown at least once.

c.ford wrote: »

Its a hell of a lot of work.

Three clicks is not a lot of work.

c.ford wrote: »

You could be waiting for a couple of thousand reloads before you get one flash up. Then once that's done, you have to start again!

You said your add 25% and the users 7.5%. If a users add is only shown once in a couple of thousand page loads then it is not going to be worth them joining, they will never make any money.

c.ford wrote: »

Even if you decided to click the ad multiple times, Google has thresholds for that kind of behaviour.

c.ford wrote: »

Nice thinking though Geordie Joe, very devious lol

I looked into this sort of thing a few years ago, not necessarily question and answer sites, but sites where a user supplies the content and get a share of the google revenue.

And they all had one thing in common. I'm sure you know what it is, as you seem to have spent some time and effort on this.

Flyonthewall

c.ford wrote: »

Fair enough, but members always have some idea of what their ID is being associated with as the site is fully categorized and doesn't deal with taboo themes.

Good. Best make sure you keep it fully monitored then. I know you said you'd whatever to monitor it but just make sure you stick to that lol. I reckon it will be more work than you realise though.

I'm not trying to make you join my site, lets be clear on that. What you do is your choice. As I said at the beginning of the thread, active involvement and feedback is welcome, but I will never try and make people do anything they don't want to.

No one said you were but I stated my reasons on my last point below the quoted comment so won't go into that again.

This is where the other revenue streams come in. There will be other ways to see that the site is genuine. Like filling out surveys, testing products, giving opinions, watching videos, doing competitions to win vouchers and points to name but a few of the upcoming features.

Sorry but more revenue streams actually give people more reason to doubt a site is legit. Think about more; more revenue streams, more money to members and the question of how is the site able to pay out so much. Course, we know how it works but many don't. Nor will they look into it. They see free money, can't see how it works and so they assume scam and avoid.

True trust comes when people see the money after it's been paid out. Obviously you need to do something to get them to that stage. Some will take the risk with it being free (only time wasted if the site doesn't pay out), others need more convincing. You need something that makes them feel they can probably trust the site the moment they go on to it and then something more when they take a closer look.

People make up their minds about a site in a matter of seconds.

Our own payout system is something that I will invest heavily in (for users and my peace of mind). For that, I don't want something out of the box. But the results have to show thats its a worthwhile endeavour before I move to that.

Are there any out of the box systems for such a site? Apart from PTC sites like Neobux I think other sites tend to develop their own systems and if not they keep quiet about what system it is. I've not seen a single thing online about such a system. However, I'm curious about such a system so if you have any information I'd be interested to know.

See above about different income streams.

It's still a risk while my own ID is on random questions though. Much as I like your other revenue systems the way of making money would have to work in a different way to my ID being used.

One thing has struck me here, and it has actually made me push back my rollout date by a month or so. It seems that people are very possessive over their G accounts. Myself, I never have been, but then I have never seen it as the be all and end all.

I think I am going to implement some of the other features first and then offer the Google publishing as an option on top of whats available in the form of surveys and vouchers etc.

Thanks Flyonthewall, you've probably done me a big favour there!

Glad to help.

Think about who your main audience would be. Who wants money and has some time? The unemployed? The retired? Stay at home Mums? Students? Their google accounts and the sites they use could be their only income.

Think about the amount of people who have successful Youtube channels or blogs. They make money through ads and their google account.

The last thing any of them want is to lose the one thing that currently gets them any money.

If you go down the route of offering vouchers remember people like different things and the internet is worldwide. Amazon is always popular but while UK amazon gift vouchers are great for those in the UK those in the US or elsewhere in the world won't want vouchers for the UK. They will want to be part of the site though and be able to earn and it makes sense from your point of view to allow members from other countries.

Flyonthewall

geordie_joe wrote: »

If a users add is only shown once in a couple of thousand page loads then it is not going to be worth them joining, they will never make any money.

That's a very good point!