Rushed NHS extractions for free???

cavework

OK .. so how much do you make as the middle man for these procedures?
I assume you then forward the work to a dental technician 'down the road'?
No offence , just asking
.. would this be a clinical dental technician you use ?

Toothsmith

The vast majority of my patients are on Denplan, so they simply pay whatever the technician charges me - and I show them the invoice!

No - I don't use a 'clinical' dental technician, as they tend to be more expensive for their extra qualification, and that would mean my patients paid more than they needed to.

cavework

But surely your patients then suffer with temp NHS or denplan dentures that become more and more uncomfortable?
TBH my main question is why most Dentists assume that living with temporary full, top /bottom ..or complete full dentures mean that the patient just has to suck it up and put up with the discomfort until their gums heal .It feels a bit like a punishment
This is not necessary ,
Why would I come to you to take a mould to send to a technician , when I can visit direct and any problems can be rectified on a one to one basis in half the time?
PS Den plan seems to be cost cutting when they pay out then ?
Also can anyone tell me if relining of NHS dentures is covered by the initial fee?

brook2jack

Possibly because there are only 230 clinical dental technicians in total in the country so most people will not have one near them. Our nearest is 50 miles away.

the nhs fee for a reline is much less than you pay your CDT and many people with dentures will be exempt from NHS charges. Many people with immediate dentures will need several relines and even if they had a CDT nearby the difference in cost would be a factor.

Our local laboratory has a 24 hour turn around time but for urgent cases I take impressions ,the patient takes them to the lab and has the work done whilst they wait.

The healing of bone and gum varies from person to person , some people wear a "temporary" set of dentures for twenty years no problems , others need them adjusted every few weeks, you can't predict who will have shrinkage and to what extent.

brook2jack

Relines are not covered by the initial denture fee on the nhs after the first two months in England and Wales. It is a band two charge.

Welsh dent doesn't have a CDT near him because there are only seven in the whole of Wales.

cavework

brook2jack wrote: »

Relines are not covered by the initial denture fee on the nhs after the first two months in England and Wales..

Thanks for this ,, so it usually takes at least 2/3 months for gums to shrink before NHS temp dentures need relining ,, but the cut off point is 2 months.
6 months at least before perm dentures can be made
No wonder so many people end up using fixatives and spend the rest of their lives choosing what they can and cannot eat because of NHS temp dentures!
Brookjack thank you for the explanation , seems we need more CDT,s available directly to NHS patients?
So people with temp NHS dentures have to wait 6 months plus for complete gum healing then have to pay again for perm dentures?

brook2jack

The CDTs would never work for the nhs. They have paid a fortune to be trained (they have to train abroad)and set up their businesses and are trained in sophisticated techniques of denture making so need to charge to cover these costs. The fees payable for a nhs denture in total will be around £240. Here is the price list of a very cheap cdt most charge much more than this , in almost every case they would lose money doing nhs work. http://www.consettdenturecentre.co.uk/price-list.html most cdts will charge around £800 for mid range top and lower dentures. http://www.bathdentureservice.com/prices

Yes people do have to pay for new dentures after initial healing but at around £200 depending where you are in the country it is a lot cheaper than going to a cdt.

McKneff

My 'temporary' dentures which at the start, needing very slight adjustment because of 'rubbing' lasted me over 2 years before I needed a permanent set. So don't be put off by that. They didn't slip or move at all until the very last month or so, he would possibly even left them longer if I didn't need another tooth added to it.

welshdent

cavework wrote: »

Sorry
Not the point.. Dentists seem to think full extractions are the end .. patient has to have full extractions, top or bottom or both .. you have false teeth now , learn to live with it

.The patient then has to put up with the consequences for 6-8 months, full temporary dentures are not the be all and end all by using fixatives ,they endure limited choices of what food they can eat because they are told to put up with it
People who have this procedure should be given all the options when having to face this .. Why are they not advised that temp dentures will become looser as their gums shrink BUT they can be relined and that they do not have to come to you to have this done?
In fact they don.t have to come back at all..if it is a full extraction of all teeth
By the way .. you say you know no one near? how far away is the dental technician you use and is he a clinical dental technician or a dental technician?

I am sorry for a second there I Thought I knew what I was talking about. My mistake,.

I have most certainly never said

"k full extractions are the end .. patient has to have full extractions, top or bottom or both .. you have false teeth now , learn to live with it"

They are most certainly NOT told live with it. They are told to pop back and see me if the dentures need adjustments and I can also do chair side relines with an acrylic resin. BUT we do not live in a perfect world and further more the human body is not a machine. Everyone heals at different rates and are able to tolerate differing levels of discomfort. It is a fact that post extractions there WILL be some unavoidable discomfort and it is a fact that the sockets will and must heal thus changing the base that the dentures sit on. A denture technician is not the authority on patient comfort and even when they are clinically trained they are not allowed to offer NHS care. I most certainly will not be paying for their services when I can do the same myself. My patients are ALL advised as to the outcomes of extraction. All are given a consent form outlining what may happen to the fit of their dentures as their gums heal. Every one that has extractions and an immediate denture. I can show you a copy of the form!
My techie is the other side of the city and no they are not a clinical techie. They make decent dentures though

welshdent

cavework wrote: »

But surely your patients then suffer with temp NHS or denplan dentures that become more and more uncomfortable?
TBH my main question is why most Dentists assume that living with temporary full, top /bottom ..or complete full dentures mean that the patient just has to suck it up and put up with the discomfort until their gums heal .It feels a bit like a punishment
This is not necessary ,
Why would I come to you to take a mould to send to a technician , when I can visit direct and any problems can be rectified on a one to one basis in half the time?
PS Den plan seems to be cost cutting when they pay out then ?
Also can anyone tell me if relining of NHS dentures is covered by the initial fee?

You can not get NHS dentures from a clinical techie. No relining of an NHS denture is NOT covered by the initial fee. The initial fee covers the cost of the denture. When you have an NHS denture made you are not paying the middle man. You are paying the NHS for a course of treatment that includes provision of at least 1 denture. In Wales that is £177. A private set of dentures are significantly more than that. My lab charge alone is almost £100