Overpayment of IS due to capital change

gillybean129

I have had a £50 civil letter penalty asking me details of why I didn't inform them of capital changes. I need to get this back in a few days.
Basically I am an appointee and am unsure of how many times you should notify after the £6k limit is reached. Is it every month, week?
I had an assessment going back over the past 15 months and this there will have been an overpayment of a few hundred hounds.
Unfortunately due to my personal circumstances I have let this slip and not kept my eye on the ball, happy to pay the fine and of course any overpayment, I just want it out of the way.
I would like to relinquish this responsibility but there is no one else to do it. I am also now the appointee for my Mum at DWP request and also 2 POA's for the same 2 people, I am finding it all too much to handle but can't see a way out of the appointee ships.

tinkledom

gillybean129 wrote: »

Basically I am an appointee and am unsure of how many times you should notify after the £6k limit is reached. Is it every month, week?

I am not able to answer the other part of your question, maybe others can, but you do raise a very interesting point - yes how many times are you supposed to notify them of any increase over the capital limit.


I have been told by the DWP - 'every time the total savings go over'. They did counter this by also saying that you need not include normal weekly/monthly income. I take that to mean that you would only notify them when the 'savings' go over the limit.


I would bring one other point up that probably doesn't affect you but it may affect other posters and that is that Guaranteed Pension Credit is changing in 2016. From that date on anybody in receipt of that benefit will for the future have to notify ANY increase in CAPITAL and INCOME as it happens. So if they have say 6 private pensions, 2 state pensions and maybe a couple of benefits that increase, you will be expected to notify the DWP of ALL changes. If they all increase at different times, you could well be in the position of having to tell them of a change of circumstances up to 10 times every year. This excludes the times when the capital limit is breached by 'savings' out of these pensions.
A nightmare for them given their ages and vulnerability.

gillybean129

I called this morning, they said any changes....I have asked someone to call to clarify this, she said initially write to us every week with bank statements, I just haven't the time/capacity to do this, I just want to give this appointee up, way too much responsibility
They class his capital as weekly benefits in his current a/c plus savings, it fluctuates wildly according to when they arrive in the account and also when his payment for his care to the council leaves he account, amongst other factors

tinkledom

gillybean129 wrote: »

I called this morning, they said any changes....I have asked someone to call to clarify this, she said initially write to us every week with bank statements, I just haven't the time/capacity to do this, I just want to give this appointee up, way too much responsibility
They class his capital as weekly benefits in his current a/c plus savings, it fluctuates wildly according to when they arrive in the account and also when his payment for his care to the council leaves he account, amongst other factors

They are being a little zealous.


Income received on say a Monday and fully spent by the following Sunday does not constitute a change of circumstances that would affect the capital position. If that was the case, the DWP would be receiving millions of letters advising them on a day by day basis of the ever changing position.


However they would have to be told if you had not spent all of your income by the following Sunday as it would then be treated as an increase in savings.


Mind you nothing surprises me any more. My income is a mixture of weekly/fortnightly/four weekly/monthly/annually payments.
Are they actually suggesting that I notify them of the nightly balance of monies held? If that is what they want, so be it, I would love to do that. I would expect them to reply to each 24 hour notification as the balances vary wildly.


The total annual monies that are paid as income total £30836 and I hold just a few pounds under the threshold in capital. As and example my total holding will be well over the limit by a couple of thousand at some time or the other, but overall I make sure everything is spent by the end of each month.

gillybean129

I don't know anyone that writes on a weekly basis, can you imagine that? I am waiting for a response and will let you know what they say

cattermole

gillybean129 wrote: »

I called this morning, they said any changes....I have asked someone to call to clarify this, she said initially write to us every week with bank statements, I just haven't the time/capacity to do this, I just want to give this appointee up, way too much responsibility
They class his capital as weekly benefits in his current a/c plus savings, it fluctuates wildly according to when they arrive in the account and also when his payment for his care to the council leaves he account, amongst other factors

I would suggest contacting Social Services who ultimately have a duty of care to the people you are currently acting as appointee for. Because this must mean that they lack capacity in some way if you have been appointed in the first place.

SS can also be the appointees.

Are there any others named on the POA? It is unusual to have just one person named as it makes it void if anything happens to them.

gillybean129

I didn't realise they could also be appointees..I have contacted a local company who will act as his appointee, I know it will cost him but my mental health is suffering over this responsibility.
He doesn't have capacity by the way and Mum was always his appointee prior to me, I'm also hers now..

I have kept telling his SW I no longer want to be his appointee and they just say there are lots of places look at the help yourself database which is what i've done

gillybean129

Hi Cattermole, no it was Me and my Mum and Dad, Dad died and Mum now has lost capacity, it's all too much, I can't tell you how stressed I am right now

gillybean129

tinkledom wrote: »

They are being a little zealous.


Income received on say a Monday and fully spent by the following Sunday does not constitute a change of circumstances that would affect the capital position. If that was the case, the DWP would be receiving millions of letters advising them on a day by day basis of the ever changing position.


However they would have to be told if you had not spent all of your income by the following Sunday as it would then be treated as an increase in savings.


Mind you nothing surprises me any more. My income is a mixture of weekly/fortnightly/four weekly/monthly/annually payments.
Are they actually suggesting that I notify them of the nightly balance of monies held? If that is what they want, so be it, I would love to do that. I would expect them to reply to each 24 hour notification as the balances vary wildly.


The total annual monies that are paid as income total £30836 and I hold just a few pounds under the threshold in capital. As and example my total holding will be well over the limit by a couple of thousand at some time or the other, but overall I make sure everything is spent by the end of each month.

Tinkeldom, if what you're saying is right each time you go over the threshold you should be telling them, I assume Capital is his savings plus everyday current, I just added the two together. There must be loads of people in this situation

Also, is there an easier way of letting them know other than by snail mail recorded these days?

cattermole

gillybean129 wrote: »

I didn't realise they could also be appointees..I have contacted a local company who will act as his appointee, I know it will cost him but my mental health is suffering over this responsibility.
He doesn't have capacity by the way and Mum was always his appointee prior to me, I'm also hers now..

I have kept telling his SW I no longer want to be his appointee and they just say there are lots of places look at the help yourself database which is what i've done

What help yourself data base? Do you have a link?

If he is receiving care from the LA which I'm assuming he is from the fact he has a Social Worker they normally have a third party scheme particularly with the introduction of Personalised Budgets etc.

There would be a small charge for managing someone's affairs but usually the LA's have approved 3rd party schemes.

https://www.gov.uk/become-appointee-for-someone-claiming-benefits

Ultimately t is the SW that has the responsibility to ensure that the person's financial affairs are being properly managed if they lack capacity. I would tell them that.

tinkledom

gillybean129 wrote: »

Tinkeldom, if what you're saying is right each time you go over the threshold you should be telling them, I assume Capital is his savings plus everyday current, I just added the two together. There must be loads of people in this situation

Also, is there an easier way of letting them know other than by snail mail recorded these days?

You got it in one & I don't know of any other way to report it. Relying on the telephone can be quite dangerous, especially if the DWP fail to note the conversation properly.


Nope, I relish the idea of sending daily reports of capital held and will expect a reply to each notifying of a change of entitlement. Should keep them busy for quite a while, that is until they tell me to stop!!!