PARKING CHARGE - Help - What do I do?

SummerTime

I received the first letter " Notice to owner" for going through a NO ENTRY at One Stop, Perry Barr..at the front where the buses go...
Says
"Defence Systems believe a parking charge is payable blar blar.."
The Driver has 14 days form service of this notice to the discountewd charges of £60. After this period the charge will increase to £100....
If no payment is made, the Defence Systems will forward me to a Debt Recovery Agency.
To pay "online " to paydefsys
or post : Pyt Dept, Suite 2, The Meadows, Church Road, Dodleston, Near Chester, CH4 9NG


Co Reg : 08047971


Does anyone know who these guys are and do I have to pay as there are so many claws for errors on private companies and you hear about scams and to ignore....
Help please on what I should do. Much Appreciated


Has BPA " Memebers of the British PArking Assocation

Redx

are those spelling mistakes yours or theirs ?

have you read this ? https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4816822

they are definitely on the BPA AOS list http://www.britishparking.co.uk/Approved-Operators

http://www.defence-systems.com/

Trebor16

Was this ticket issued by a private parking company or has it been issued by a local authority?

marleyboy

It sounds like a local authority issue. That being the case, you have little to appeal on and should possibly master learning what "BUSES ONLY" & "NO ENTRY" signs mean.

There is nothing to stop you appealing as I am sure you wont have as much difficulty in reading the appeals procedure before filling it in.

HO87

marleyboy wrote: »

It sounds like a local authority issue. That being the case, you have little to appeal on and should possibly master learning what "BUSES ONLY" & "NO ENTRY" signs mean.

There is nothing to stop you appealing as I am sure you wont have as much difficulty in reading the appeals procedure before filling it in.

Whoops Marleyboy!

This might sound like a local authority issue but I can assure you that it is not. This is most certainly a private (so-called) parking matter. The One Stop at Perry Barr is well known haunt of private parking companies.

@ OP Can you confirm the name of the company that have issued this PCN?

EDIT: Sorry missed the company reg. no. <rolleyes> but it is late! Defence Systems Ltd aka Parkwatch BPA AOS members. I'd be very interested to know quite how they intend to interpret what may be described as a "moving traffic offence" as opposed to a "parking event" if they intend to comply with the provisions of the Protection of Freedoms Act.

@OP this is baloney. However, draft up an appeal to go to Defsys, or whatever they fancy calling themselves that sounds threatening and official, in the following terms:

Defence Systems Ltd
Blahblahblah
Chester

Dear Sirs

Re. Notice To Owner, dated XX/1/2014

I refer to the above Notice and for the avoidance of doubt I am the registered keeper of the vehicle in question. As the registered keeper I wish to appeal the issue of it on the following grounds:

1. The alleged location is not "relevant land" within the terms of the Protection of Freedoms Act.
2. The occurrence alleged is not a "parking event" within the terms of Protection of Freedoms Act.
3. The Notice to Owner was served outside the statutory timescale required by the Protection of Freedoms Act.
4. Defence Systems Ltd has no authority or lacks suffiicient authority to issue charges in relation to alleged occurrences.
5. Defence Systems Ltd signage or the signage they are intending to rely upon in this case is deficient in the sense that there are insufficient signs to be seen by motorists when entering the area and that in any event the signage is incapable of establishing the basis of a contract.
6. The charge Defence Systems Ltd are seeking to levy does not represent a genuine pre-estimate of their loss or that of their principal.
7. If, in the alternative, it is Defence Systems Ltd case that what they are seeking to enforce is a core contractual term then it is clear that the intention of such a term is to deter specified conduct and that the charge is therefore a penalty masquerading as a charge. Contractual penalties are not enforceable at law.
8. The existence of a contract between the driver at the time and Defence Systems Ltd is in all events denied.

On the basis of the foregoing I invite you to immediately withdraw your charge or promptly issue a POPLA appeal reference in order that I may make further representations to them.

Please Note: I give you due notice that if you do not withdraw this matter forthwith but choose to pursue it further then I will hold you liable for the costs I incur in researching and preparing my appeal to POPLA, dealing with and responding to any further correspondence from you, your agents or assigns and any future proceedings you may issue. Such costs may include (but are not limited to) my time (at the court approved rate of £18 per hour), my travel expenses, photography, photocopying and postage and such other expenses as may reasonably be occasioned. These charges become payable on presentation of my invoice. The acceptance of these terms will be determined by performance.

If you have any doubt as to your legal position you are advised to seek independent guidance.

Yours faithfully

SummerTime

At the very least this should produce a rejection from DefSys together with a POPLA code. Once that is in your hands then we can compose an appeal to POPLA. Our success rate at POPLA is currently 100%. Once the appeal to POPLA goes in then I suggest you submit an invoice to DefSys (holding them to the last paragraph of your letter) and we'll see how they deal with that. If on the other hand they fold, well they've just saved you a few hours research (which it might have been nice to have charged them for!).

SummerTime

Thank you guys and big thank you to H087...


I have been searching for hours regards to this and making notes and H087 has done it all for me.... I can't thank you enough...


Would it be worth putting in the letter too :
Notice To Keeper / Owner (Under the Protection of freedom Act) :
Where no notice to driver was served, ANPR was used, notice must be served NO LATER than 14 days to be valid .....
(Offence was on 24.12.13 - Date of Notice 28.1.14 (Over 30 days!)


I will be sending the letter off on 30th.... So fingers crossed and will let you know how it goes.


Thank you H087....


(New to these forums, so I hope I've reply in the correct manner.


Many Thanks

HO87

@SummerTime

A very good point. I'll re-edit the draft letter for you to include it - so it looks tidy!!

SummerTime

H087!!!!!!!!!!Excellent......can not thank you enough.... sent letter recorded delivery...... reply within three days. CANCELLED!'''' What can I say... but your the best and thank you for your time in helping. Much appreciated. Claire xxxxxx

Coupon-mad

Well done HO87, a brilliantly worded challenge!

TBH this is worth reporting to the local Trading Standards as a complaint. And to the BPA (Steve Clark). This is baloney, as HO87 rightly said.

If a firm is pretending they can enforce a No Entry sign and pretend it comes under the BPA (AOS scheme) as 'parking charges' then it's misrepresentation for starters. Breach of UTCCR1999 and CPUTR 2008... What next? Dropping litter fines all purporting to be supported by the BPA?!

AS_Textiles

Hi everyone,

I have had exactly the same situation, almost identical.

They have rejected my appeal on the basis of below:

"After reviewing the information provided within your appeal letter and the photographic evidence that was taken in support of the issued PCN, we have decided that the parking charge was correctly issued for failing to comply with the parking conditions at the One Stop Shopping Centre. There are signs clearly stating that vehicles should not enter the bus Interchange at any time, including two No Entry signs, A Buses Only Instruction, and four other high visibility warning signs.

The land in question is “private” land and Defence Systems have been given authorisation by the land owners to manage this land in line with British Parking Association Codes of Conduct."

They have not answered most points, in particular 2,6,7 and 8 which are more or less the basis of their fine. I'm going to take this further.

Any help would be appreciated. Thank you.

ColliesCarer

Hi AS_Textiles,

I'm assuming you sent HO's brilliant letter above as your appeal but could
you please create you own thread for further advice.
Also when you post on your thread, could you confirm whether they have issued you with a POPLA code in the rejection letter.