Complicated will situation.

MissMango08

Hi everyone I'd be really grateful if you could give some advice!

When my grandma was alive, she was married to my step-grandad. As far as I can make out, they had mirror wills. In it, it stated that the house they have would be split four ways, between my mum, her sibling, and then his 2 children. My mum and one of his children are executors of the will.

To cut a long story short, my grandma died a long drawn out death with cancer. Within a couple of months, my step-grandad had got with another woman. We are assuming because he is still alive, there was no need for probate for my grandma, as everything went to him.

We don't trust him, he is an evil man for many things that he has said and done. A couple of months after her death he said he wanted to get the will 'checked', and as far as my mum can remember (she was still traumatised at the time, before she was put on medication) it still said the same thing, that the house be divided 4 ways.

We've recently found out that he is now moving in with this woman. My mum wants to know:
- Can he go against her mums wishes, and not give my grandmas half of the house to my mum and her sibling?
- Can he change the will without her knowledge?
- Can he remove her as an executor of the will without her knowing?
- Will him cohabiting with this woman change anything?

My mum doesn't care for the money in a monetary sense, she isn't fighting for it in that way, she's fighting for it because he was a very controlling abusive man towards my grandma, and left her in bits on multiple occasions. She wants to get this money just so that he doesn't get it, and my grandmas wishes are respected. But from my perspective, my mum could really do with this money in the future, as my dad is having a quarter of his brain removed next month, in the hope that it will stop his seizures. They aren't in the best financial situation, and this would really help provide financial stability in this unexpected part of their lives.

Thank you in advance for any help!

Torry_Quine

This isn't what you want to hear but presuming that her will left everything to him he is free to make a will leaving it to who-ever he wants.

Can he go against her mums wishes, and not give my grandmas half of the house to my mum and her sibling? Yes

- Can he change the will without her knowledge? Yes
- Can he remove her as an executor of the will without her knowing?Yes
- Will him cohabiting with this woman change anything? Only if he leaves her something in a will, she won't automatically inherit if not married.

Mojisola

Torry_Quine wrote: »

- Will him cohabiting with this woman change anything? Only if he leaves her something in a will, she won't automatically inherit if not married.

But if he dies without a will, only his children will inherit, not his step-children.

dzug1

Mojisola wrote: »

But if he dies without a will, only his children will inherit, not his step-children.

But the post does mention mirror wills, though only as an assumption.


Other 'problems' - who actually owned the house? If jointly, what form of joint ownership? It might not have been your grandma's to give and may automatically have become the husband's property.


Did the will set up a trust with the husband having a lifetime interest? If so he can't readily change that.

RAS

Assuming England or Wales; Scottish law is different.

Who owns the house?

And what sort of tenancy?

If tenants in common, then mum's part can be left to whoever she wanted (as long as it was written correctly).

If joint tenancy, then step-dad owns the lot now.

And if he re-marries any existing will becomes void. Even his own chidren may end up with nothing as the new wife takes priority in an intestate case.

MissMango08

Thanks for replying everyone I really appreciate it! I've just had a chat with my mum, and she's now pretty certain it was a joint will, rather than mirror wills, because she only signed one document.

However she said in the will it said something along the lines of: Upon death of one partner, the surviving partner will inherit the property, however on the death of the surviving partner, the proceeds of the property will be divided between the 4 beneficiaries.


I feel quite ashamed I don't know the answers to these questions myself, I graduated with a Law degree this year but property and trusts was never my strong point...

securityguy

MissMango08 wrote: »

Thanks for replying everyone I really appreciate it! I've just had a chat with my mum, and she's now pretty certain it was a joint will, rather than mirror wills, because she only signed one document.

You can't make joint wills under English law; each party will have made a separate will.

However she said in the will it said something along the lines of: Upon death of one partner, the surviving partner will inherit the property, however on the death of the surviving partner, the proceeds of the property will be divided between the 4 beneficiaries.

If it created a trust, then that's one thing. But otherwise, there's nothing stopping a surviving party from making a new will. A will can place assets in trusts; it cannot bind survivors to not alter their own wills. Regular reading of MSE tends to suggest this latter point is not fully understood.

LilElvis

MissMango08 wrote: »

Thanks for replying everyone I really appreciate it! I've just had a chat with my mum, and she's now pretty certain it was a joint will, rather than mirror wills, because she only signed one document.

However she said in the will it said something along the lines of: Upon death of one partner, the surviving partner will inherit the property, however on the death of the surviving partner, the proceeds of the property will be divided between the 4 beneficiaries.


I feel quite ashamed I don't know the answers to these questions myself, I graduated with a Law degree this year but property and trusts was never my strong point...

Your Mum is going to need to get a copy of her Mother's will as 'something along the lines of' is far from definitive. My Grandparents wills left everything to the surviving partner for their lifetimes and then for the value of the property to be split between their 2 children. My Grandfather died first, and everything therefore went to my grandmother for her lifetime. Except she had a huge falling out with my aunt and changed her will to effectively cut her out, leaving 90% of her estate to my parents. It was actually hers to do with as she wished, regardless of what they had decided as a couple 40 years previously because of the way in which the will had been worded.

Finding out the exact provisions of your Grandmother's will is the only way of knowing what her husband can and can't do with her estate.

securityguy

Let's spell this out.

Suppose a couple A and B make mirror wills of the form "I leave all my assets absolutely to my spouse; if they should predecease me, I leave all my assets to our children C and D". The intention is that if A dies first, their assets go to B (without creating a trust with all its cost and complexity) and then when B dies they pass to C and D (and similarly if B dies first).

However, there is nothing whatsoever to stop B writing a new will leaving everything to their secret lover, their dog or the local donkey sanctuary. Wittering on about what A wanted, or what was in A's will, is irrelevant: if it's left absolutely to B, B can do what they want, and anyone can at any time write a new will. B doesn't even have to wait for A to die; they can revoke their mirror will and replace it with a new one the morning after signing the mirror will, and they don't have to tell anyone.

If A doesn't want B to be able to leave it all to the RNLI, A has to write a will that leaves the assets in trust, which will be expensive, complicated and potentially disadvantage B. There is no other way to do it. A will cannot bind the people to whom assets are left unless it creates a trust.

MissMango08

LilElvis wrote: »

Your Mum is going to need to get a copy of her Mother's will as 'something along the lines of' is far from definitive. My Grandparents wills left everything to the surviving partner for their lifetimes and then for the value of the property to be split between their 2 children. My Grandfather died first, and everything therefore went to my grandmother for her lifetime. Except she had a huge falling out with my aunt and changed her will to effectively cut her out, leaving 90% of her estate to my parents. It was actually hers to do with as she wished, regardless of what they had decided as a couple 40 years previously because of the way in which the will had been worded.

Finding out the exact provisions of your Grandmother's will is the only way of knowing what her husband can and can't do with her estate.

Thank you. You wouldn't happen to know if solicitors can give out copies of the will would you? Going to him for it is not an option...

azzabazza

MissMango08 wrote: »

Thank you. You wouldn't happen to know if solicitors can give out copies of the will would you? Going to him for it is not an option...

I would have thought that your Mum would be entitled to receive a copy of the will if she is one of your grandmother's executors. Presumably from your grandmother's solicitor?

However, having never been in this situation I may be wrong.