How long before poking PE for a response?

teabelly

PE sent a relative an invoice.

They sent back the parking cowboy template letter amended for their circumstances. Seemed fair. One template letter for another

Date of incident was early December and they only received the PCN on the 14th day.

When should they prod PE into a response as I'm thinking they are planning just to ignore the soft appeal altogether and play dumb?

Or is it better to wait until the 35 days are up (which date is that counted from?? ) and just say 'tough luck you didn't respond and I've got a certificate of posting bwhahaha your spurious charge is null and void'

The template mentioned response within 14 days and full response within 35 days and mentions BPA code of practice. I'm expecting if PE respond it's with their usual template long letter saying they're court geniuses and never lose with a load of out of date court cases attached and other rubbishy non existent justification.

Relative did get proof of posting but sent it via second class mail (they're a bit cheap) so is that sufficient along with a copy of their letter? Can PE argue it isn't a real appeal as it is a template letter?

I wish I'd seen the short and sweet ones first as they might have been better to send initially but I thought the cowboy one would at least make them have to provide all the information asked for.

The relative also contacted the site in question about the ticket and they weren't very helpful. Do PE have contract clauses that try and prevent landowners from interfering once PE have issued their invoices?

Everything is occurring in England so English rules apply.

android26

teabelly wrote: »

The relative also contacted the site in question about the ticket and they weren't very helpful. Do PE have contract clauses that try and prevent landowners from interfering once PE have issued their invoices?

The landowner employs PE or another PC as they don't want the hassle of dealing with parking. So no surprise they aren't interested.
I've read that some companies charge the landowner an amount to cover their costs etc, if a request to cancel is processed. Whether this a genuine pre-estimate of loss is another matter.

teabelly

Odd thing is the landowner were in the paper saying the system had been suspended due to the number of complaints. This article pre-dates the PE letter by a couple of days so I think PE are are issuing notices without permission of landowner and that the person my relative contacted were the ones mentioned in said newspaper article saying they were to be contacted if they had issues with PE! I was quite surprised at their attitude. They've employed PE and PE are causing massive problems for visitors. It's been in the local paper regularly since the stupid system was introduced too.

The old system was the take a ticket and pay on exit so you couldn't leave without paying the right amount and it told you the right amount. The PE system as installed can't even tell visitors the right amount to pay or even why they have a ticket.

android26

If you can get a copy of the news article to include, maybe on the papers website, even more ammunition to getting it quashed before it goes any further. What type of premises is the car park? Retail park, shopping centre? Is there no way of making a forceful demand it be quashed by the landowner with the back up of the news article? Either way, with the help of regulars on here tweaking your popla appeal, your relative should be ok. Just keep reading the stickies and appeal info.

nigelbb

If it wasn't this hospital then it must be another site that has been blighted by the same insane system specifically designed to generate maximum profit for PE

http://www.burtonmail.co.uk/News/Relief-for-patients-as-Queens-suspends-controversial-parking-fines-20131212071115.htm

teabelly

It was a hospital. Which makes it all the more reprehensible in my book.

I'll have to check with my relative about what was said and whether the person they spoke to were going to make a genuine effort in getting it cancelled.

I have bookmarked article on newspaper's site

I don't think PE should have issued the demand in the first place when the article said all notices were being suspended until a review had been undertaken.

teabelly

nigelbb wrote: »

If it wasn't this hospital then it must be another site that has been blighted by the same insane system specifically designed to generate maximum profit for PE

http://www.burtonmail.co.uk/News/Relief-for-patients-as-Queens-suspends-controversial-parking-fines-20131212071115.htm

Same system. I shall be urging my relative to draft a complaint to the CEO and point out the more disgusting nature of PE's behaviour too.

Taking a disabled driver to court over a 10 minute over stay in a free car park is one court case I think they should mention.

Are there any others that show PE as being utter scumbags??

Coupon-mad

lainieee's case was pretty bad, look at her thread.

4consumerrights

teabelly wrote: »

Are there any others that show PE as being utter scumbags??

Where to start..............


Teabelly - if I'm right in my recollection that template letter sent to PE is more of a question and answer scenario - personally I do not like that letter as it can and has been proven on this site that PPCs do not consider it an appeal and can initailly fail to send a POPLA code

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4817923

The questions raised (such as contract and signage, unfair terms etc (GPEOL) are valid POPLA appeal points in any case.

teabelly

I suggested that one because the notice from PE was so vague as to be almost useless. A few blurry pictures of a car and no mention of what contravention occurred ie didn't pay, over stayed and had paid. Nothing. With an RK hat one you'd want more information to decide what to do. It's the relatives first PCN so I think they needed more information first. I had no idea that the code of practice was updated often so it may refer to an out of date version.

The one I suggested is different to the one displayed in that thread:

[FONT=Arial, serif]Without prejudice, except as to costs
[/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]Parking Charge Notice - Notice to Keeper [Give its [/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]ref number[/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]][/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, serif]This letter is a [/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]formal challenge[/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif] to the issue of your Parking Charge Notice - Notice to Keeper as set out in the[/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]current[/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]BPA Ltd AOS Code of Practice B.22[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, serif]On ([/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]date[/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]) I was the registered keeper of a ([/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]make and model of vehicle[/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]) registration number ([/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]reg number[/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]).[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, serif]Before I decide how to deal with your Parking Charge Notice - Notice to Keeper, I should be grateful if you would first answer all the questions and deal with all the issues I have set out below. Once you have done so, I will be able to make an informed decision on how I deal with the matter. [/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, serif]I should be grateful for specific answers to all questions raised. In this respect I remind you of the obligations set out in the current Practice Direction on Pre-Action Conduct.

I dispute your claim for the reasons set out below. Please note that although I dispute the whole basis of the parking charge, my main concern is its disproportionate and punitive level.

[/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]1. Your parking charge amount claim.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, serif]Please explain on which of the following grounds your claim is based:[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, serif](i) Damages for trespass[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, serif](ii) Damages for breach of contract[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, serif](iii) A contractual sum[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, serif]2. Your loss.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, serif]If it is your case that that a trespass was committed or that a contract was breached such that your claim is one for damages; please give me a full breakdown of the actual losses which evidences that this parking charge is a true reflection of the damages caused solely by the alleged parking contravention.


[/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]3. Your status – the creditor.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, serif]Your Parking Charge Notice - Notice to Keeper simply mentions /FONT][FONT=Arial, serif][I]Insert name of parking company if that is who is named on the PCN/NTK[/I][/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif. Please tell me who is the actual creditor making this £[insert amount] parking charge demand. I need to know exactly who is making the claim and in what capacity.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, serif]4. Ownership of premises.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, serif]Please tell me who owns the car park as I wish to send them a copy of this letter.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, serif]5. Contractual Authority (as required by [/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]BPA Ltd AOS CoP B.7)[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, serif]Please provide me with a copy of the contract between your company and the landowner/landholder that provides the necessary contractual written authority for the issue and enforcement of your Parking Charge Notice - Notice to Keeper.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, serif]6. Signage.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, serif]If it is your case that a contract has been breached or that a contractual sum is now due, please send me photographs of the signs that you display and upon which you seek to evidence that a lawful and legally enforceable contract was been entered into. Please ensure that the photographs show the terms and conditions in a clear and legible manner. Please provide me with a diagram showing the locations and layout of those signs at the car park. [/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]Also provide evidence that the wording is in plain and intelligible language and in sufficiently large print as to be legible to a driver at the car park’s entry point.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, serif]7. Summary[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, serif]I look forward to receiving your acknowledgement within 14 days and as there are no ‘[/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]exceptional circumstances[/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]’ your comprehensive reply within 35 days ([/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]in accordance with the BPA AOS Code of Practice B.22.8[/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]). I will then be able to make an informed decision as to how I deal with your Parking Charge Notice – Notice to Keeper. [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, serif]If you reject this challenge or fail to address the issues that have been raised then, [/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif]in accordance with the BPA AOS Code of Practice 22.12[/FONT][FONT=Arial, serif], please ensure that you enclose all the required information (including the necessary ‘POPLA code’) so that I may immediately refer the matter for their decision.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, serif]If you fail to follow any of the procedures outlined in the BPA AOS Code of Practice or your legal requirements under the Protection of Freedoms Act, or the requirements of the Practice Direction on Pre-Action Conduct then I will make a formal complaint to the DVLA Data Sharing Policy Group, D16.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, serif]Please Note: Unless you have specifically requested it and received my express permission, you do not have my authority to disclose or refer this letter or any other communication from me to any other person or organisation.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, serif]Yours

Perhaps there is a better way of writing the above?

[/FONT]

nigelbb

teabelly wrote: »

[FONT=Arial, serif]Without prejudice, except as to costs
[/FONT]

Do you know what this means or why you would head a letter thus?

Drop this fake legalese.