Landlord withholding deposit - am I responsible for this bill?

Soot2006

Be worth getting the 3x deposit ...
then you can pay him the £650 and still be quids in.

Then your moral obligation is satisfied (because you have paid for your heating). And his legal obligation is satisfied (because he has been punished for non-protection of the deposit).

G_M

diavolina wrote: »

I didn't know about the central heating system while I was living in the flat; I've only discovered this since this bill came to light.

????

How could you live somewhere and not notice it was being heated....??

:huh:

Ah well.

As for the wording of the T|A, another interpretation the court might make is that
a) the heating system is provided by a gas/electric boiler whatever
b) the TA says: "all charges for gas and electricity consumed on or supplied to the property "
c) therefore you must pay your share of the total bill

However as others have said the failure to register the deposit (if England, and indeed not registered) opens the LL up to the 3 timespenalty.

diavolina

So it doesn't make any difference that the management company couldn't bill me without the landlord's permission and he didn't give them that permission?

kmmr

I think you need to know exactly what heating this covers.

If the electric heaters in the flat are attached to your own electricity meter, then you have already paid for your heating, so there is no 'moral obligation' to pay this bill. If these heaters are powered by the communal heating/power, then you can argue the legalities, but morally you should probably pay.

This additional charge may relate to heating of the common areas or some other area. Or even perhaps an accident of history which used to cover your flat, but during some old renovation the communal heating system was removed from your flat and replaced by electric storage heaters for ease.

If it's a communal area charge, or something that doesn't relate to your flat anymore, then the LL should cover it. It's like any other fee (management, ground rent) that the landlord covers, and takes into account when setting the rent level.

kmmr

G_M wrote: »

????

How could you live somewhere and not notice it was being heated....??

:huh:

Ah well.

I think OP was slightly unclear in the first post, but since then has clarified that there were electric storage heaters, which provided the heat. And s/he paid an electricity bill.

I think it's reasonable for a tenant to assume that the heaters were attached to the electricity being paid for. It may be that they are attached to some other electricity supply, but that's pretty unusual, and I'd agree the LL should have informed the OP in that case.

diavolina

kmmr wrote: »

I think you need to know exactly what heating this covers.

If the electric heaters in the flat are attached to your own electricity meter, then you have already paid for your heating, so there is no 'moral obligation' to pay this bill. If these heaters are powered by the communal heating/power, then you can argue the legalities, but morally you should probably pay.

To be honest I find it all a bit confusing and unnecessarily complicated myself. There was basically a dual heating system in the apartment: the electric heaters in my flat which were powered by my own electricity supply that I paid for, and the heating generated by the communal boiler that was not immediately obvious in the apartment i.e. there were no extra heaters or anything like that. I have no idea HOW exactly it heated the flat. I find it to be quite a strange system and the first time I have ever encountered anything like it.

I have recently bought my own flat and I pay my mortgage, the service charge to the management company, and my electricity bill to npower. There is no bizarre additional heating charge!

benjus

diavolina wrote: »

I have no idea HOW exactly it heated the flat. I find it to be quite a strange system and the first time I have ever encountered anything like it.

Was your flat cold when your electric heating was switched off? Did you need to use the electric heating as much as you expected to? Were your electricity bills "normal" or noticeably low? Is this central heating system definitely for heating the apartments, or just communal areas? (although it would seem very odd to have central heating for communal areas but not for the apartments)

RAS

diavolina wrote: »

To be honest I find it all a bit confusing and unnecessarily complicated myself. There was basically a dual heating system in the apartment: the electric heaters in my flat which were powered by my own electricity supply that I paid for, and the heating generated by the communal boiler that was not immediately obvious in the apartment i.e. there were no extra heaters or anything like that. I have no idea HOW exactly it heated the flat.

So ask? Ask the LL to explain to you where the outlets for the communal heating system were in the flat?

This could be something like underfloor heating, heating or hot water or indeed part of the service charge for the communal spaces.

G_M

I suspect a hot air system (with air outlets) which residents can supplement if they want with their electric heaters.

But it's all guesswork really.

RobertoMoir

From the OP's description this sounds like a right mess. I would say that if the LL wishes to operate such an over-complex system, it is at least somewhat beholden upon them to:

1) Explain it clearly to their tenants in the rental agreement
2) Demonstrate at least some competence in billing people for this service.