Success:- Crown Point North versus PE

Redx

Hi to all

firstly I must thank all those on the forum that have helped newbies like myself in wording appeals etc, and to all members please read the sticky threads and many other threads to make sense of what is going on and to learn what to do if you get a "parking ticket from a PPC like PE or Excel

I used information from here to successfully help a relative put in a "soft appeal" to PE over a problem of an overstay on the Crown Point North car park in Denton , Manchester recently. This private car park is a shopping complex and has a 4 hour "maximum stay" with no return for 2 hours, no money is paid or expected to be paid and there are no ticket machines on it, but plenty of "signage"

Due to the large number of shops and having lunch in one of them the RK / driver overstayed by up to 1 hour and an "invoice" was sent out in the usual format that abounds on here, cheaper if you pay early etc

I got photocopies of various receipts showing patronage of various shops that day and composed a "carrot and stick" appeal whereby we used mitigation as the carrot (only using the shops on the complex) and the stick was the BUT IF scenario whereby we asked for a POPLA code, details of landowner, copies of contracts , mentioned that no "losses" had occurred as its not a Pay and Display CAR PARK , etc etc. the wordings showed we werent just a numpty that hadnt done any research and that we wanted all paperwork, a genuine pre estimate of loss (GPEOL) etc , basically all the sorts of questions on documentation and costs and just so that they knew we would go to POPLA, we also made sure the RK complained to the manager at BHS as the RK had started and finished in there , we also clearly asked for the landowners details so we could complain to them too

It didnt take them long to cancel the charge completely !!

so in this case a strongly worded "soft appeal" to the initial invoice worked as they clearly did not want to part with all that info and then have to go to POPLA when you consider their only duty is to enforce the parking restrictions, as no money changes hands at all on this particular car park. Its a park for free but dont overstay the 4 hours car park - clearly to encourage a high turnover in parking spaces available for those shopping there

just thought I would share this with you all

ie:- a soft appeal can work, receipts can be vital, they dont always turn you down , especially if you make it clear what you require if they do turn you down - that they will have a fight on their hands and that you will go to POPLA , win your case and cost them more money in doing so

so I again thank those of you who regularly reply with the correct advice , templates and so on

and to all newbies who havent done their research, please read the sticky threads, read similar cases to your own , read as many threads as possible , do the research, learn the basics and make sure you appeal in the correct time frames if you are in England and Wales

do not ignore , unless somebody qualified to tell you to ignore actually says so, as obviously it may be different in Scotland and Northern Ireland

thanks to all

ps:- I have also helped in a POPLA appeal for another RK who parked and overstayed at Gala Bingo , Ashton U Lyne , monitored by Excel Parking, the popla decision should be made this week, so hopefully it will be upheld on a not a GPEOL strategy, although I have not just relied on that one defence obviously

the initial "soft appeal" was made on mitigating circumstances, which obviously they laughed at and issued a Popla code

one thing I noticed on this other case is that they only allow 30 minutes free parking, yet the heavily redacted "contract" clearly states that stays under 60 minutes are free and so as the overstay wasnt very long it comes under that 1 hour free rule on the contract which has been halved by Excel on their notices (I believe Gala Bingo may be the landowner - not sure about this yet)

so time will tell on this one too, but I expect a standard GPEOL verdict !!!

Guys_Dad

Thanks for coming on and telling your experience. Well done and good luck with the next one.

Umkomaas

Well done redx.

You'd be more than welcome to join us in the fight on here. I'm sure you'd be well able to give good advice to newbies, given your experience, and ability to beat the PPC rodent.

Redx

thanks to all the respondents so far, please note that I did all my research before joining the forum under this name as I could not find my original login details as its a while ago, so I used most of your posts and links as the basis of my help to my relatives in these 2 cases, but good info nonetheless

I was just wondering if anyone can tell me if these popla decisions are sent my email by snail mail or by both methods ?

I ask because the other excel popla appeal went in by snail mail but did have an email address included and all the popla paperwork including the excel challenge came back by email and not snail mail , so I was wondering if you get a quick decision by email with verification by snail mail in writing at a later date ?

judging by the decisions posted already I would have thought that they were copy and paste replies as nobody is going to spend an hour typing them out in full , lol

but I also thought that an official letter would count as evidence in case the PPC did not play ball, on the other hand you would assume a printout of the appeal would count from a legal point of view as it would have the official details on it anyway

not really sure how long after the actual appeal decision date set by POPLA that you actually receive the decision letter or email ?

thanks for any replies

Coupon-mad

I think it's by email if an email address is given in the appeal submission, and most decisions are currently sent fairly close to the decision date suggested by POPLA.

Redx

chased it up and for some reason they determined the outcome weeks ago but my relative didnt receive anything at all

anyway , its the usual not a gpeol

xx November 2013
Reference xxxxxxxxxx
(Appellant)
-v-
Excel Parking Services Limited (Operator)

The Operator issued parking charge notice number xxxxxxxxxx arising out of the presence at Ashton Retail Park, Ashton-under-Lyne, on ** July 2013, of a vehicle with registration mark xxxxxxx.
The Appellant appealed against liability for the parking charge.
The Assessor has considered the evidence of both parties and has determined that the appeal be allowed
The Assessor’s reasons are as set out.
The Operator should now cancel the parking charge notice forthwith.

krona

Hi can anyone send me a letter they have used to respond to this type of fine. I stupidly ate lunch there spent loads of money in shops and now this . Help appreciated as not even sure what popla is !!

Redx

its not a fine

its stilll 4 hours

you need to read the NEWBIES sticky thread for an example of an appeal, then use it on their website, attaching COPIES or scans or pictures of the receipts or redacted bank statements for the payments made on site, to prove patronage of the shops there

as for popla, if you dont know what it is, google it and read their website, where its all explained

ie:- when you dont know something, google it