Newbie in distress! Unfair parking charges - Car Parking Partnership

ReformedBigSpender

First off, I’d like to thank everyone who has posted onthese boards with information helping people avoid these hideous charges (especiallyCoupon-mad, zzzLazyDaisy, Guys Dad and Umkomaas, whose usernames I’ve seen onso countless posts today) and who give me hope in fighting for my rights!



The car in question got slapped with a windscreen ticketyesterday afternoon by the much loathed CAR PARKING PARTNERSHIP, and while I’vealready read the newbie guide, Umkomaas’ guide, and a host of other threads, Ihave a few things I’d like to be advised on before I begin my battle.



1) Firstoff: I’m NOT paying – these charges are bogus and unethical.

2) Thedriver was not the registered keeper – my car was at the garage, and I’dborrowed my mother’s for the day.

3) Thecar was parked at work (a University), and while my own vehicle has a parkingpermit, my mother’s doesn’t – the normal way it works here is that you need toattain a day permit if you are not driving your usual car, but after being upseveral times in the night with a chollicky 3 week old baby, it completelyslipped my mind… until I saw the notice on the windscreen, of course.

4) Ishould add that WE DO NOT PAY FOR PARKING at my institution – it is my understandingfrom what I’ve read here today is that the PPCs can only “claim” for lostrevenue, parking fees etc. so surely they have no case against me here?

5) I’vealready tried the relevant low-levels at Estates & Buildings, but they justtell me it’s an external company, and that there’s nothing the University cando – where do I stand/who do I contact in this instance instead of theMD/Manager/CEO or Land Owner?

6) Ilive and work in England; as I said I’m not the licensed keeper, but it’s not ahire or courtesy car, either; and I’m, sadly, well over 18



As a side note, I’ve noticed on the BPA that CPP are NOTregistered with them for Debt Collection – does this make any difference?



Please, MSE champions, help me out so I can get back to mybroken and frequently disturbed sleep.



Thanks in advance everyone!

jeanraffio

First things first, whilst it's good that you are getting prepared, the big thing with a windscreen ticket is that you get the NtK through your door first before worrying too much. PPCs have a very bad problem with:

a) Sticking within the time limits to send the NtK, and
b) Ensuring they are compliant

If they fail at either of these then it is a very easy guaranteed win and you may have done too much work and stressed too much without even needing to.

bod1467

Just remember that it is YOUR MUM who will get the NtK (not you), so make sure she's primed about this and doesn't just ring them up and pay in a panic.

All further correspondence (appeal and POPLA as necessary) will be from the registered keeper ... whether or not it is actually you who handles it doesn't matter.

Coupon-mad

bod1467 wrote: »

Just remember that it is YOUR MUM who will get the NtK (not you), so make sure she's primed about this and doesn't just ring them up and pay in a panic.

All further correspondence (appeal and POPLA as necessary) will be from the registered keeper ... whether or not it is actually you who handles it doesn't matter.

Yep as above, just wait for the NTK and make sure all the correspondence is sent in your Mum's name as keeper thereafter. You can write it of course but put her name. Be aware that I think CPP may be non-compliant and late with the first letter which may be from a debt collector and look worrying. But the first letter IS the NTK.

ReformedBigSpender

Thanks for the quick responses everyone! I've tried to tell her the protocol, but she's already getting frightened at the prospect and threatening to just pay the fine for me (she's not even as old as that makes her sound, and she's a secondary school teacher to boot!) That' one of the big reasons this has got me so annoyed : these companies bullying tactics are so unethical! And to think it's my employer's fault, really, too!

Stroma

When the NtK arrives, if she is not prepared to handle this, it will have a facility to name you as the driver, send it off then her liability ends and they must chase you instead as defined under schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012.

Tell your mum not to get nervous about these cretins, they are full of bluster and bull xxxx

jeanraffio

Yes, don't stress about it. They are scumbags who twist legislation and force propoganda to try and make you pay. They have to do this because they KNOW that what they're doing is wrong and they lose through the official independent appeal.

BUt if your Mom is truly worried, write to them and state under POFA 2012 you were driving and must now only deal with you as the driver. You can then take them on and win at appeal.

Don't let your mom pay!!!

ReformedBigSpender

No no, I certainly won't be letting her pay - I've got 2 weeks to persuade her, and with the advice on the forum here, I'm sure I'll prepared to do just!

4) I should add that WE DO
NOT PAY FOR PARKING at my institution – it is my understanding from what I’ve
read here today is that the PPCs can only “claim”for lost revenue, parking fees
etc. so surely they have no case against me here?

Am I right in thinking the above? I can't remember what I read where to make me believe this, but if someone could corroberate, it would make me feel a lot better (and my mother, too)

jeanraffio

ReformedBigSpender wrote: »

No no, I certainly won't be letting her pay - I've got 2 weeks to persuade her, and with the advice on the forum here, I'm sure I'll prepared to do just!


Am I right in thinking the above? I can't remember what I read where to make me believe this, but if someone could corroberate, it would make me feel a lot better (and my mother, too)

In essence yes. PE try and say that with signage, office costs, running the cameras etc then there is an implied cost (a figure that they themselves say is approx £53). Of course this is wrong as these are costs of running the business (as many courts have pointed out), not what you've cost them by parking there. Hence, there is no Genuine Pre Estimation of Loss (GPEoL). The POPLA appeal winner!

Either way, when they send you a bill for £100 that is way above what even they themselves say is their 'cost', so they don't have a leg to stand on - as numerous POPLA appeals and court appearances have testified.

ReformedBigSpender

Aye, the ticket itself said £60 if I pay in 2 weeks, and £85 thereafter. The thing which first made me think it must be a scam (a University-condoned, enabled and contracted scam) was the pressure to pay within 2 weeks - set alarm bells going on my BS detector immediately!

Fortunately, a quick search on the trusty MSE forums confirmed my suspicions!

Stroma

And on the above, they cannot claim for their own alleged losses as they are not the creditor, and not the landowner/leaseholder ! So in essence they are not even supposed to bring small claims in their own name. Some district judges are lacking in knowledge and that is why some claims are awarded to them. Any competent judge who knows contract law will throw out these spurious claims.