public speaking on planning applications

pingua

Has anyone any idea how formal these things are???

Anyone any advice on how to go about it???

Ahhhhh

Hot_Puppy

Unfortunately had to go to one once so will share my experience in case it helps.

Most of the councillors appeared to vote according to pre-conceptions, i.e. that all applications are "bad" or "good" and the details were merely a distraction. It was a wet winter evening and it appeared they would all rather tick boxes and get home.

There were several other applications discussed in the same sitting and the one's with the most (vocal) support in the room at the time tended to get their way so if you can round up some people with similair opinions to yours I'd suggest that is a good idea. The Mob Rules to some extent.

Would also say that your best bet might be to catch out the opposing side on a technicality e.g. letting the other party talk over the time allowed etc. Would suggest taking a stop-watch... (seriously! to time yourselves and your opponents)

At our meeting one of the councillors arrived half way through the discussion on our item and then tried to vote (after declaring an interest in knowing the applicant!). The Secretary pointed this out as being incorrect and discounted the vote but it's a reflection on how shambolic it can appear.

We were first timers so missed all these discrepancies ... if you want to ask any further advise I will gladly pass on what I can.

pingua

Well, thanks for that. Fingers crossed but I don't hold much hope. Not sure what good 3 mins of talking can really do.

Gold_Shogun

You should also note that allowing applicants to address the meeting is PURELY at the discretion of the Councillors, and unfortunately nowadays, many Councils tend to refuse permission OR insist upon written submissions only as they consider it "inconvenient" to them.

I have had much success by (also) sending a SHORT letter (too long = doesn't get read properly) with my "supporting points" to my LOCAL Councillor, PLUS a "Courtesy Copy" (by Recorded Delivery --> to make sure they take notice of it) to EACH of the other members of the Planning Committee (which the Planning Dept. MUST tell you who they are) ....
It Also helps to print off a "Second Set" of the letters which you can place on the desk in front of each member before the meeting starts.

P.S. DON'T FORGET to include the "Planning Application Reference Number" in BOLDFACE at the TOP of your letter, so that the Councillors can easily "match" your letter to the application itself.

You'd be surprised how effective these few little "Jedi Mind-Tricks" can be, ESPECIALLY if you turn up at the meeting all prepared to speak BUT are refused permission to (as OFTEN happens).

My old dad always used to tell me ...
... If you Fail to prepare, then prepare to Fail !!!

:cool:
:beer:

Debt_Free_Chick

Gold_Shogun wrote: »

You should also note that allowing applicants to address the meeting is PURELY at the discretion of the Councillors, and unfortunately nowadays, many Councils tend to refuse permission OR insist upon written submissions only as they consider it "inconvenient" to them.

True that it's at the discretion and true that few Councils don't allow it - but the main reason for this is that far too many people simply rant on and on, full of emotion, rather than present clear facts. Also, not all planning applications go to committee - the vast majority are decided by the planning officer, under delegated powers (as Councillors are simply elected lay-people, but planning officers are qualified experts who are employed by Council to guide them on the planning law).

Whether or not you attend the Planning Committee meeting, you should put your comments (objections) in writing. Many local planning authorities have a facility for you to do this online. Remember that your comments will be on the public record - including your name & address - so keep to planning issues and avoid anything personal.

It's not necessary to send copies to each member of the planning committee - if the application goes to committee - as the plannning department prepares a report on each application and this includes the comments received.

Whatever your comments, the application will be decided on planning law and not the sway of public opinion.

Finally, the planning officer will make a recommendation to the Planning Committee and the Committee is unlikely to go against it (see above - as the planning officer is the expert on planning law). By all means go to the meeting, but it's unlikely to carry any more weight than simply submitting your comments in writing.

Gold_Shogun

Debt_Free_Chick wrote: »

Also, not all planning applications go to committee - the vast majority are decided by the planning officer, under delegated powers
... For clarification, APPROVALS can be granted without reference to the Committee under "Delegated Powers", BUT Proposed REFUSALS are reserved to the Committee itself (along with "Proposed Approvals against Policy") ... The fact that the OP indicates her application IS going to the Committee strongly suggests that her application falls within the latter 2 categories.

Whether or not you attend the Planning Committee meeting, you should put your comments (objections) in writing. Many local planning authorities have a facility for you to do this online.
... Agreed to an extent, but from practical experience, I strongly recommend the "Personal Letter" approach rather than the "Official's Summarised Comments" (which are often simply glossed over/ignored by the Committee Members.)

It's not necessary to send copies to each member of the planning committee - if the application goes to committee - as the plannning department prepares a report on each application and this includes the comments received.
... I strongly disagree (See my previous comment)

Whatever your comments, the application will be decided on planning law and not the sway of public opinion.
Finally, the planning officer will make a recommendation to the Planning Committee and the Committee is unlikely to go against it (see above - as the planning officer is the expert on planning law).
... Theoretically, YES ... In Practice, NO ... The Planning Dept./Officials are more concerned with "Pure Planning" Issues, BUT the Committee Members more often make many of their decisions on a "Local Politics" basis ... AND a well phrased personal letter to each Member (plus enlisting the support of your local Councillor for the Meeting IF possible ---> a.k.a. "The Old Boys Network") can go a LONG way towards swaying that Political Decision in the Applicant's Favour.

Cheers
Bob

Debt_Free_Chick

Gold_Shogun wrote: »

For clarification, APPROVALS can be granted without reference to the Committee under "Delegated Powers", BUT Proposed REFUSALS are reserved to the Committee itself (along with "Proposed Approvals against Policy") ...

Does that vary between different LPAs? In my LPA (Rother, East Sussex) refusals can (and are) quite definitely dealt with under Delegate Powers. The Case Officer makes a recommendation, this is reviewed by the Development Control Manager and the Head of Planning makes the decision.

For more complex cases (defined in the LPA's policies), the recommendation of the planning department is simply circulated, electronically, to all Councillors. They then have the option to call off an application so it is heard by the Planning Committee. If it is not called off, then the Head of Planning implements his decision - again under delegated powers.

In Rother, very few applications go to Committee. And, of course, whilst a decision might be made by the Committee, very often there are a number of supplementary conditions which are delegated back to the Head of Planning.

BUT the Committee Members more often make many of their decisions on a "Local Politics" basis ... AND a well phrased personal letter to each Member (plus enlisting the support of your local Councillor for the Meeting IF possible ---> a.k.a. "The Old Boys Network") can go a LONG way towards swaying that Political Decision in the Applicant's Favour.

I think we'll have to agree to disagree on that one. In the past, this may well have been the case, but it certainly ought not to be now. If you look at ANY decision - grant, or refusal - it must clearly state the reasons WHY permission was given or refused. It will make reference to a whole host of planning policies - National, Regional and Local. Any decisions not based on planning policies stand a very good chance of winning, on appeal to the Planning Inspectorate.

Finally, the decision makers (be they Head of Planning or Planning Committee) will only take into account material planning considerations. They will not take account of:-

• Trade Objections (e.g. we don't need another supermarket as there's already one)
• Moral objections (e.g. we don't need a betting shop as it's wrong to gamble)
• Loss of view (There is no right to a private view, but potential loss of amenity value, generally, would be considered)
• Property values (e.g. a neighbour's fears that their property will be devalued)
• Ownership (interestingly, anyone can apply for PP to develop any land, anywhere. Though it might be pointless to do so, unless you have some agreement with the landowner)
• Covenants (these are private, civil rights and nothing to do with whether the development would be allowed, under planning law)
• Personal comments (pretty obvious, but a surprising number of objections are based on purely personal matters)
• Matters relating to construction, should PP be granted (e.g. hours of work, noise, dust, vehicles etc)

I've stated this on other similar threads - and it's purely my personal opinion (although I am also a Parish Council Clerk and my view is influenced by the effect of the PC's comments) - there is little point in objecting, unless you know enough about Planning Policies. As refusal needs to state the reasons why PP is not granted, those reasons must be covered by one of the Planning Policies. So if your reason is not one covered by Planning Policies, it won't be a good enough reason to refuse PP.

As an aside - for the reason stated above, many Parish Councils no longer bother to comment on Planning Applications as they simply do not have sufficient knowledge of Planning Policies to enable them to make a valid objection.

Regards

Debt_Free_Chick

As an example of reasons for granting PP, have a look at this Planning Application.

It attracted more than 40 objections (although far too many were personal attacks on the applicant!!).

The Planning Department's report & recommendations to the Planning Committee is here on pages 81-94 and in particular the reasons for allowing PP, despite the objections, on pages 93/94.

Note, for interest, the 24(!!) conditions attached to PP.

My only purpose here is to emphasise that the granting or refusal of PP must be for reasons set out in Planning Policies.

Regards

pickles110564

With my only expierence of trying to obtain PP, I got a booklet from the government ( sorry i have forgotten its name) which informs you of the reasons why PP can be refused.I also got the local plan for PP from the council.
I then took on board what the neighbours had used for their objections and using the booklet and local plan was able to use their objections as reasons for approval.
Armed with this info and giving the planning officer a weeks notice i arranged a meeting to go over my case. The outcome was that the planning officer agreed with all the points i had brought in backed up with examples in their booklets and agreed with our plans and said that it did not need to go to the panel and granted PP

Gold_Shogun

Debt_Free_Chick wrote: »

Does that vary between different LPAs? In my LPA (Rother, East Sussex) refusals can (and are) quite definitely dealt with under Delegate Powers.

Yes indeed ... It is up to the Planning Committee of each Authority to decide the exact Policy they wish to use ... Perhaps I should have made that clearer, for which I apologise.

I've generally found that Urban committees tend to delegate most decisions to the Planning Director as you say, in contrast to Rural committees which often prefer to reserve consideration of proposed Refusals and/or "Contentious Applications" to the committee itself.