PPC - NGP Cardiff - on what basis to appeal?

[Deleted User]

I understand current advice is to appeal the PPC and also to write to stores etc.

But whats a valid reason for appeal?

In my case, wife was taking her elderly mother out shopping. She hasnt got a blue badge (waiting to sort it our) but can't walk far, so she parked in a disabled bay.

To be honest, I always thought blue badges were irrelevant for private land in any case which is why she always parks in disabled bays.

Should I use this as basis for appeal? Or should I just say shes got a blue badge and forgot to display it or something?

Umkomaas

First off, you're quite correct that BBs are not relevant on private land. And this will be a major point in the appeals process. But first it would be better if you could give us some details so that we can give you some more comprehensive advice.

1. Was this a windscreen ticket?
2. Or an ANPR camera capture?
3. Date of incident?
4. Have you had a letter through the post (Notice to Keeper)
5. Date on the NtK?
6. Are you the Registered Keeper of the car?
7. Or is it a company or hire car?

Let us have that detail and we'll progress from there.

Guys_Dad

I wrote a version of this on another thread but it is equally applicable here.

You are making the newbies' common mistake which is "I done wrong, guv, so what can I appeal on???".

Our point is " regardless of the facts, PPCs are penalising motorists to a ludicrous extent to which they are not entitled and we concentrate on helping people based on that point".

Your initial appeal, assuming the answers to Umkomaas' questions pan out will be to the PPC probably expecting to be turned down but seeking a POPLA code. We are 100% successful at POPLA.

But when you come back with Umkomaas' answers, as he says, you will get tailored advice.

[Deleted User]

Umkomaas wrote: »

First off, you're quite correct that BBs are not relevant on private land. And this will be a major point in the appeals process. But first it would be better if you could give us some details so that we can give you some more comprehensive advice.

1. Was this a windscreen ticket?
2. Or an ANPR camera capture?
3. Date of incident?
4. Have you had a letter through the post (Notice to Keeper)
5. Date on the NtK?
6. Are you the Registered Keeper of the car?
7. Or is it a company or hire car?

Let us have that detail and we'll progress from there.

1. Recieved in post.
2. Looks like pictures were done manually by someone walking around the car.
3. 23/10/13
4. Yes
5. 29/10/13
6. Yes I am
7. Nope.

Umkomaas

Are you able to scan the NtK and upload it here? Redact any detail that identifies you or your car. Interested in your bit about someone walking around the car taking photos which then become a NtK delivered within a few days of the parking incident.

Here's how to upload.

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/1690399

Coupon-mad

UKCPS also do the same - they treat them a bit like ANPR postal PCNs - and so paragraph 9 of Schedule 4 must be adhered to in the wording of the Notice.

It won't be!!

[Deleted User]

http://i920.photobucket.com/albums/ad50/paulfoel/parkingticket0001.jpg

Coupon-mad

I am not seeing the 'period of parking' on that NTK and didn't see the PPC named as 'creditor'. But we can't tell without seeing the whole back as well. Needs to have certain wording about POPLA as well, which you will find if you Google 'schedule 4 Protection Freedoms' and read the actual ACT, paragraph 9.

Nice that the actual Notice states the charge is for 'breach'!! Therefore they do have to show loss, as long as you draw the ticket wording to POPLA's attention.

[Deleted User]

Heres the back:-

http://i920.photobucket.com/albums/ad50/paulfoel/parkingticket-back0001.jpg

Coupon-mad

Yep, a non-compliant Notice to Keeper, which is handy for you.

- No 'period of parking'

- No identification of the creditor

- No warning to the keeper about how they will become liable if they don't take action

Google 'schedule 4 Protection Freedoms' and read the actual ACT, paragraph 9

And also include in your appeal that:

The driver as taking the elderly passenger shopping (enclose copies of any receipt for the site but keep the original). The passenger has significant mobility problems, so the driver parked in a disabled bay knowing that the Equality Act 2010 applies and that Blue Badges are not the only indicator of disability need. As the keeper you appreciate that the operative would not have known that unless he/she saw the passenger struggling - but it is a fact that the passenger meets the legal definition of disability and was a genuine customer.



(Notice that you refer in the third person to 'the driver' and 'the passenger' at all times to keep yourself as keeper 'at arms length' and the driver anonymous).

[Deleted User]

Coupon-mad wrote: »

Yep, a non-compliant Notice to Keeper, which is handy for you.

- No 'period of parking'

- No identification of the creditor

- No warning to the keeper about how they will become liable if they don't take action

Google 'schedule 4 Protection Freedoms' and read the actual ACT, paragraph 9

And also include in your appeal that:

The driver as taking the elderly passenger shopping (enclose copies of any receipt for the site but keep the original). The passenger has significant mobility problems, so the driver parked in a disabled bay knowing that the Equality Act 2010 applies and that Blue Badges are not the only indicator of disability need. As the keeper you appreciate that the operative would not have known that unless he/she saw the passenger struggling - but it is a fact that the passenger meets the legal definition of disability and was a genuine customer.



(Notice that you refer in the third person to 'the driver' and 'the passenger' at all times to keep yourself as keeper 'at arms length' and the driver anonymous).

So is 'period of parking' relevant since its a ticket for parking in a disabled bay not overstaying?

OK. Thanks. So first job is to appeal to PPC? Any good template letters?

This one any good - http://www.legalbeagles.info/forums/showthread.php?43086-Template-Appeal-Letter