Will Question

joerugby

dzug1 wrote: »

Nothing should have come out of that bank account - it should have been frozen on death.

The expenses of winding up the estate, funeral, etc, should have come from other assets - I'm assuming there must have been some

OTH beneficiaries taking too much notice of estimated figures being bandied about out of context can be misleading - and a good reason why many executors stay stumm until they are finished.

I doubt if he's taking the mick - more likely ignorant of what he should be doing

................... but if there were no other assets ..........................?

John_Pierpoint

30 odd years ago, it might well have been possible to put a widow into a house owned by her children. [I did this inadvertently 45 odd years ago with my mum.] with the bereaved parent retaining Principle Private Residence relief for those children against Capital Gains Tax.
As you have already observed, in those days house prices were probably not such a significant part of a family's wealth. So your parent/uncles/aunts mighty have retained these "grandfather" rights to relief from CGT when swapping grandmother from house to flat in their names.

So let us cut to the chase:

1. Grandfathers date of death was .................
2.. You have extracted and printed a copy of grandmother's flat's title from the land registry on line for £3 and it says exactly.................................It is possible that your grandmother had an interest in possession and her trustees are named as the legal owners ? [The fact that these trustees happen to be your dad, auntie and uncle is pure coincidence and is not legally significant].
3. You have obtained a copy of Grandfather's estate's letters of administration/grant of probate (admon) together with copies of his will, in order to double check what should have happened when granddad died?

As you are presenting the facts at the moment grandmother owned virtually nothing but a few personal things and a bank account. I really cannot see how clearing the flat and transferring the the bank account into the executor's account, plus the cost of the funeral, could cost more than a few thousand at the most.
I am not sure, but I would guess that the departure of a life tenant from a property does not give rise to a charge against their estate, unless there have been serious dilapidations during their "tenancy". Even then the burden will depend on the details in grandfather's will and the provision it makes for his widow.

If grandmother's will makes you into a residuary beneficiary, you are entitled to accounts showing how you share has been calculated, the fact that you are being offered anything and your share is being charged with expenses rather suggests that you might well be a residuary beneficiary.

Be very careful about jumping to the conclusion that you are a victim of fraud, there are all sorts of perfectly legal, but seemingly unfair provisions, that can be created by clever accountants and lawyers. [Just take a look at your electricity bill ?!]

McKneff

partialycloudy wrote: »

Well that is interesting!
Bascially my nan lived in a house all her married life but my Grandad dies 30 odd years ago and the kids (my parent and his siblings) had the house put in their names and they paid the mortgage. The house was sold 8 years ago and a sheltered flat was bought, for my nan, with the proceeds (again in her childrens names). So the property being sold is actually my parents and siblings so all funds from that will be split between them.
I first heard that my nan had £18k in her account, but until the flat was sold all the maintance charges were being taken from that account and from what I understand the costs from the selling the property will be taken out of her account.
The flat is now under offer and near completion and I have now heard we can expect to see £10k split between us....which if the original £18k was correct then £8k of charges in two months seems a little excessive!!!!
Also thinking about it, the money it costs to sell the property should come out of the proceeds of the sale...I would've have thought??

I dont want to start any family rifts over money as its not worth it, but I also dont want someone taking the mick! I would imagine the cost of the EA and solicitors would be no more then £2k.

I would think it would be a lot more than that, double it and you might be somewhere near

Mojisola

partialycloudy wrote: »

my Grandad dies 30 odd years ago and the kids (my parent and his siblings) had the house put in their names and they paid the mortgage.

The house was sold 8 years ago and a sheltered flat was bought, for my nan, with the proceeds (again in her childrens names). So the property being sold is actually my parents and siblings so all funds from that will be split between them.

I first heard that my nan had £18k in her account, but until the flat was sold all the maintance charges were being taken from that account and from what I understand the costs from the selling the property will be taken out of her account.

So much of this "depends" - on what the arrangement was for your Nan living in a property owned by her children and exactly what the will says.

Unless there is paperwork to say something different, the owners of the flat should be paying all the costs of selling their flat.

nom_de_plume

partialycloudy wrote: »

Well that is interesting!
Bascially my nan lived in a house all her married life but my Grandad dies 30 odd years ago and the kids (my parent and his siblings) had the house put in their names and they paid the mortgage. The house was sold 8 years ago and a sheltered flat was bought, for my nan, with the proceeds (again in her childrens names). So the property being sold is actually my parents and siblings so all funds from that will be split between them.

From what I make of this the flat did not belong to your nan but to your parents, etc.. Unless there was any form of life interest in the property for nan, it has nothing to do with her estate and any and all expenses relating to it, including service charges and the like should probably be borne by the owners and not the estate (IMO). On top of this there is a possibility of capital gains tax liability for the owners.

You need to establish PRECISELY the ownership of the property and the nature of your nan's occupation of it.

partialycloudy

Deleted .........

Mojisola

partialycloudy wrote: »

My Dad is not on any other mortgage so he would not be liable for CGT would he?

Yes - he's selling a property that hasn't been his main residence.

I dont think anyone would purposefully do something underhand but might not be aware of the "right" way to do things.

They'd have to be incredibly naive to think that it's normal that someone else should pay for the sale of their property!

However, there may have been an agreement drawn up which allows this to happen so question gently!

John_Pierpoint

Please please get hold of the facts before you cloud the issue further by talking about things you don't yet understand - none of us are psychic

AMILLIONDOLLARS

~Beanie~ wrote: »

No, you won't get to see it as a matter of course.

Once probate has been granted, you can get a copy by applying to the Probate Service but you will have to pay for this.

Not all Wills go through probate, it depends on the amount of the Estate.

AMD

John_Pierpoint

......and the nature of the assets - it is looking like the would be executors have managed to wangle that bank account through the system, without getting probate first.

Which bank was it?. Assuming there is no real estate, are there any shares, even any privatisation/demutualisation ones?