Service Charge - Square Footage

KennyH1

How can I find out the square footage of all the flats in my block?

I have asked the management company for the figures but they say they cannot give me the figures for other peoples flats.

We have previously been told our 2bed flat was the largest in the block so therefore we pay more based on square footage but it has now come to light that there are at least 2 3bed flats that seem to be larger than ours.

eddddy

KennyH1 wrote: »

How can I find out the square footage of all the flats in my block?

I have asked the management company for the figures but they say they cannot give me the figures for other peoples flats.

We have previously been told our 2bed flat was the largest in the block so therefore we pay more based on square footage but it has now come to light that there are at least 2 3bed flats that seem to be larger than ours.

Are you saying you are the leaseholders of the flat? If so you may be heading down a dead end street with this.

The service charge is whatever it says in the lease. When you bought the leasehold, you agreed to the terms of the lease - it is a binding contract.

(The management company are probably saying that the service charge documented in each lease is 'roughly' based on square footage.)

Changing the %age of the service charge that each leaseholder pays will mean getting the agreement of every leaseholder and the freeholder. (And I doubt that the 3 bed flat leaseholders would volunteer to pay more service charges anyway.)

And then everyones leases would have to be varied. If it's a big block the legal fees will be thousands!

So if you are talking about a leasehold, the short answer is that if you didn't like the service charge apportionment, you shouldn't have bought the flat.

KennyH1

eddddy wrote: »

Are you saying you are the leaseholders of the flat? If so you may be heading down a dead end street with this.

The service charge is whatever it says in the lease. When you bought the leasehold, you agreed to the terms of the lease - it is a binding contract.

(The management company are probably saying that the service charge documented in each lease is 'roughly' based on square footage.)

Changing the %age of the service charge that each leaseholder pays will mean getting the agreement of every leaseholder and the freeholder. (And I doubt that the 3 bed flat leaseholders would volunteer to pay more service charges anyway.)

And then everyones leases would have to be varied. If it's a big block the legal fees will be thousands!

So if you are talking about a leasehold, the short answer is that if you didn't like the service charge apportionment, you shouldn't have bought the flat.

Thanks. I'm aware that the SC is set out in the lease and that's what my wife and her sister signed when they bought the place. The lease is typically vague and states "a fair proportion as determined by the management company".

Now while I understand this, we have been told previously that our service charge is the highest as we have the largest flat in the building, but as previously mentioned it has now come to light that there are several 3bed flats in the building and they seem larger than ours therefore I wish to find out either the floor areas of the flats or the % proportion of each flat to see if the SC is fair and reasonable rather that just take the management companies word for it.

propertyman

This is a tricky one as there is no legal basis to withhold the % allocations of the service charge calculation, and certainly to answer your question they need not identify the flats, only a list of the %s and the areas. Assuming the agent is a member of ARMA or the RICS they maintain a formal complaints procedure and recourse to the Ombudsman.

Of course this is common mistake as a 3 bed flat looks bigger and often isn’t as I have dealt with your sort of question before. The last one I remember well as the 2 bed was 900 odd m2 and the 3 beds 890 odd m2 about 15 m2 different.

You could visit the planning office and look at the drawings and take measurements if its been built in the last 20 odd years.

I would suggest that you write as follows.

Under clause xxxx the service charge for out block are allocated on a fair and reasonable basis. I am told by you that this is on the basis of area and that having the largest flat in terms of area our % is the largest contribution.

Since moving in and getting to know our neighbours I suspect that the allocation is incorrect. There are several 3 bed flats, and while the number of rooms does not affect a share based on area, I believe that the area of the flats is larger than mine.

There is no lawful reason why the landlord’s allocation of the %s across the board cannot be revealed to justify the recovery of the service charges on the basis that it is apportioned.

In the circumstances I am prepared at this stage to compromise and ask for a list of flats without flat or plot numbers showing the % and area on which it is based. This information will be on the original service charge matrix or ( if this is built since 2000) in the O & M manual passed over by the developer.

(if the agent is a member of ARMA or RICS) I am not happy about the earlier replies and therefore wish to pursue this as a formal complaint through your complaints process, and if required through to the Ombudsman service.

(If accounts have been produced and certified under section 21 Landlord and Tenant Act 1985 In the meantime) I wish to exercise my right under section 22 to inspect the accounting records and underlying documents, which must include the basis of apportionment. http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?43830-Leaseholders-Right-to-Summary-of-Expenditure-LTA-1985-s-21


These chaps are just trying to avoid the paperwork and potential disputes and recalculation if you are right.

AndyGuil

My experience with these is the service charge has been the same for each flat no matter the size. Looking at sold and for sale properties on Zoopla for example may show the floor plans for a number of different properties.

KennyH1

How do I find out if the agent is part of ARMA or RICS?

Nothing on their website so should I assume not.

propertyman

There should be logo on their letterhead bills or website, alternatively you can phone either organisation and ask.

There are some large agents who are not members.

Does the website offer a complaint policy or procedure or are they members of the Ombudsman service

KennyH1

No logo one either the headed paper or website. No complaints procedure or policy on web site either.

KennyH1

Just checked ARMA and not down on their website as a member.

propertyman

then you go along the route of your rights to inspect the accounts and underlying paperwork and if required ask the FTT to determine the charges and apportionment.

Take a look at this for any other shortcomings in their billing to add pressure to them http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?47824-Service-Charge-Bills-“Do-I-have-to-pay-it-“and-“-Is-it-valid-”

vectistim

You can get one calculation of the sizes of some of the flats by looking at all the available EPCs.