Getting a Copy of a 20-25 yr old will

SlimmingSusan

My mother was one of 6 children, the second eldest.

She was adopted by her real father's brother and wife at 2 years old, and found out at 11 that her 5 cousins were actually her 3 brothers and 2 sisters.

They are all reconciled, and have been as long as I remember, and also her parents, my grandparents, always treated me as theirs, me and my 9 cousins.

I was left the same as my cousins in my Nanna's will (grandad passed away first), but mum has always been messed up by all this, and was never contacted to see the will, as she would not be if adopted I suppose.

She does not want anything other than to see the will and see if she was mentioned in any way. This is not about money, Mum is very well off, it is about being recognised as having an existence.

Mum and her siblings are on very good terms, but I feel massive compassion for my mother, and all she wants is to see the will, to answer the question she has been stewing on for the last 20 odd years. I cannot remember the exact year, but am going on my son's age.

My heart bled for her today as we buried dad's ashes, and I really want to do this for her.

This will be cathartic to me, as I feel the way she is treating me comes somewhat from this issue. I really can see her going downhill, and now we've said a final goodbye to dad, it would really help me to do this for her, and myself also.

Mum always tried to ask Nanna why? Nanna would never even look at her or talk about it when she tried. It also made me feel 'different' as a child, as we lived away and the family lived in a local area. In recent years I wish I had woken up about it and asked Nanna why.

How can we get access to this will please?

Grumpelstiltskin

Assuming it was England or Wales the information is here.

http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/probate/copies-of-grants-wills

SlimmingSusan

Thank you Grumpy, yes it's England, sorry forgot to mention that

jackyann

If this helps your mum sort out her feelings, that's good. If you or she need more help about this, I have always found the Post Adoption Centre very helpful - google them - they have a helpline etc.

madbadrob

The thing is a will would only be there for inspection if probate was granted but if it was then yes you can get copies of wills back to 1858 from the probate office at Leeds.

Rob

Mojisola

SlimmingSusan wrote: »

My mother was one of 6 children, the second eldest.

She was adopted by her real father's brother and wife at 2 years old, and found out at 11 that her 5 cousins were actually her 3 brothers and 2 sisters.

They are all reconciled, and have been as long as I remember, and also her parents, my grandparents, always treated me as theirs, me and my 9 cousins.

I was left the same as my cousins in my Nanna's will (grandad passed away first), but mum has always been messed up by all this, and was never contacted to see the will, as she would not be if adopted I suppose.

She does not want anything other than to see the will and see if she was mentioned in any way. This is not about money, Mum is very well off, it is about being recognised as having an existence.

Mum and her siblings are on very good terms, but I feel massive compassion for my mother, and all she wants is to see the will, to answer the question she has been stewing on for the last 20 odd years. I cannot remember the exact year, but am going on my son's age.

Mum always tried to ask Nanna why? Nanna would never even look at her or talk about it when she tried. It also made me feel 'different' as a child, as we lived away and the family lived in a local area. In recent years I wish I had woken up about it and asked Nanna why.

Has your Mum done the obvious and asked her siblings if they have a copy of the will? Has she asked them if they know why she was adopted?

I think it's extremely unlikely for there to be anything in the will that will answer her questions.

There's often one sibling who looked after the parents as they got frailer - that's the one who usually knows all the family stories and secrets. As people get older, the distance between the events and the present makes it easier for them to talk about what went on.

If your Gran has any siblings still alive, try asking there. I know someone who was talking to an elderly great-aunt about how lucky she felt to have such a good sister as X when the g-aunt piped up "X isn't your sister, my dear, she's your mother." As happened quite often, if an unmarried daughter had a child, the grandparents raised their first grandchild as their own child.

If your mother's adoptive parents were unable to have children of their own, your Gran may have been put under a lot of pressure to let them have one of her children. It could be that she couldn't explain why she done it without making whoever had pressurised her into doing it look really bad.

I hope she can find some answers but often the answers die with the older generation.

John_Pierpoint

Adoption was not legal until the mid 1920s.
Illegitimate children in Victorin times used to be taxed at 9%, when their (wicked) mum died (I don't know how long that law survived) and right through until the 1960s, retaining respectability was vital to most families.
"Fallen" daughters would disappear to a "mother and baby home" until fit to return with the hope that most people would not have guessed the truth.

Good luck to your mum, if she wants, in these enlightened times, to ferret about for an explanation; but sometimes it is better to let sleeping dogs lie.

madbadrob

John I think you may have worded that wrongly. In 1929 the government brought in the adoption laws which allowed for official adoptions to begin. Adoption was never illegal but wasn't recognised for inheritance reasons prior to this date.

Rob

John_Pierpoint

Would "unlegal" do?
Perhaps a bit like "a gambling debt" does not exist legally because it has no legal standing for enforcement?
I think we might be getting into the area of criminal law versus civil law; as being played out by two blond children in Greece and Ireland.

http://www.ktvl.com/template/inews_wire/wires.international/27fa262d-www.ktvl.com.shtml

Do you know when the changes were made in death duties law to recognise and not discriminate against "illegitimate" children. When was it possible to legitimise children by marrying the mother ?

I have done a bit of genealogy and turned up a blushing bride who emigrated to Australia with a 2 year old infant; an uncle George, who should have inherited the family business but chose to dose his liver with alcohol (apparently, I have not extracted the death certificate); plus another Great.....uncle George, the executor who tried to get away with only paying fifteen bob on his niece's £75 inheritance in place of the correct £7/10/0.

Sort of reminds me of the long distance guard on "Amtrack" who DNA swabbed his wife's half a dozen children only to discover that a couple of cuckoos had also visited the nest.

madbadrob

John_Pierpoint wrote: »

Would "unlegal" do?
Perhaps a bit like "a gambling debt" does not exist legally because it has no legal standing for enforcement?
I think we might be getting into the area of criminal law versus civil law; as being played out by two blond children in Greece and Ireland.

http://www.ktvl.com/template/inews_wire/wires.international/27fa262d-www.ktvl.com.shtml

Do you know when the changes were made in death duties law to recognise and not discriminate against "illegitimate" children. When was it possible to legitimise children by marrying the mother ?

I have done a bit of genealogy and turned up a blushing bride who emigrated to Australia with a 2 year old infant; an uncle George, who should have inherited the family business but chose to dose his liver with alcohol (apparently, I have not extracted the death certificate); plus another Great.....uncle George, the executor who tried to get away with only paying fifteen bob on his niece's £75 inheritance in place of the correct £7/10/0.

Sort of reminds me of the long distance guard on "Amtrack" who DNA swabbed his wife's half a dozen children only to discover that a couple of cuckoos had also visited the nest.

John no I don't although I should having been in the genealogical field in one form or another for 30 years. Ill do a bit of digging and find out though

Rob