New fencing and gates - its all wrong!

Purplebat79

Hi Guys and Gals

Hoping for a bit of advice .

Particulars :
12ft x 6ft double gates with crossbeam and 6x6 vertical fencing either side with concrete posts supplied and fitted.

Concrete posts, fencing and crossbeam fitted 19.7.13, Gates fitted 20.7.13. Paid for on 20.7.13 after fitting, cash (they didnt like cheques), they fitted a day before I was expecting them so I foolishly paid them quickly as theyd been sat outside my house for an hour while I was coming home from work.

What went wrong - partner came home, spotted the gates werent fitting correctly, one was dropping slightly. They had put wheels (on outside!) of gate as we wanted the crossbeam removing (it was set at height of 5ft8 and heads were bumped). They wouldnt raise the crossbeam as the posts were already concreted into place so wheels were compromise to carry some weight.

Partner phoned company not happy, was told someone would come and look at the problem when the flagging had been done and the bolt holes could be drilled, so call when flags were down - ok.

28.7.13 - flagging done and driveway ready to test - cars very narrowly fitting into driveway. Measured the gates - each gate was 5ft9, so we were 6 inches shorter than our agreed (and paid for) size which explained problem getting cars in.

Fencing company arrived that evening, told him the problems.
Said he could fix the hanging problem and move the wheels to the inside but size of the gates couldnt be changed as they were made to measure and it would come out of his pocket. Argued our case, said he would speak to gaffer and call back 9am Monday 30.9.13. Partner was only in till 12 and they finally arrived at 12.10, did the alterations on the gate without letting anyone know they were there. No phonecall to either of us.

I saw gate on return from work, gates were fitted worse than before and now with extra holes from alterations and the wheels inside which are neither use nor ornament. I rang fencing guy myself, who again said he wouldnt fork out for new gates when I put the size issue to him again, so I politely and firmly argued my case and said I would rather sort this amicably rather than get Trading standards involved.

His first offer :
Move the concrete post on one side over 6 inches. Then supply one new half of the gate, 6 inches wider. Leave the other gate as it is (i.e. 2 different sized gates). I said no and would he personally have that kind of gate on his drive - no answer.

I argued that for a company with 35 yrs experience and supposedly such good customer service (according to their website) I hoped they could sort this out. Being out of pocket wasnt my problem when the gates they fitted were not what I had asked for and were no use to me. He then offered to come wednesday to move the right post, then come saturday to fit new gates. BUT - I have since found that the left post (one that was staying put) is wobbly and loose and not holding the weight of the gates anyway and that is why they are dropping.

If they guys come and fit a new gate and posts its gonna ruin a few flags on the new driveway and someone needs to pay for that as well.

I really dont want them to come back, i'd rather have a refund and get someone else in. The work looks shoddy, and I dont believe is worth the 700 quid I paid. Id rather start again and try someone else.

Any advice greatly appreciated. Where do I go from here?
Thanks in advance. Large sherry in hand, im gonna be having nightmares about these bloody gates.

Pam x

lincroft1710

You have to give them the chance to put right their mistakes, which they have offered to do.

Purplebat79

Thanks the reply, much appreciated. The guy is due to come round tomorrow to make a start. One major issue for us - if he takes up the posts it is going to disrupt the new flagging and will damage at least 4 paving slabs - am I within rights to charge them for the repairs to that due to the fact that they botched the fencing first time round?

With the company's attitude so far it's highly unlikely they will want this extra cost too and they'll probably tell me to do one. I found out today that the guy in question is actually the gaffer himself so he had no intention of speaking to a senior manager to ask advice about the size problem.

harrys_dad

Why on earth would you pay cash? ("they don't like cheques", I wonder why???) Seriously, if you get jobs done in this way you must realise you are not necessarily dealing with a reputable company. Do you have a receipt? Are they VAT registered? Did you pay VAT? How much did you pay? Did you get quotes from other companies? Did you check their work on other sites? What was the agreed specification? Did the 5'8 headbar agree with that?

I am really sorry you have ended up with problems, but not sure where this is going to go.

Purplebat79

Im new to building stuff, this is the first project ive ever had done on the house. I use card wherever I can and very rarely pay anything with cash, but with having building work done and got used to paying a bit of cash out for sand/cement etc it seemed no great deal to pay cash. So, very gullible, yes, seemingly so, but believe me we are learning a big lesson from this.

I had recommendations from other people who had used them many years ago in the past, there was good feedback on their website, chap seemed knowledgable after coming to give us a quote. Other fencing companies couldnt offer us the size gate we wanted, photos of their work seemed acceptable to us.

I didnt get a receipt at the time (yes I hear the groans), but i paid out quickly because I felt pressured to as they were sat waiting outside my house and I felt rushed. Ive read about making payment as paid under duress but thats a bit late now. VAT was included in the price. They are registered with companies house, no idea about VAT registration?

The specification was written down on a sheet for us and agreed on, and the gates they gave us were not this specification as well as being a bad job. Spec was 12ft gates with crossbeam with 6x6 vertical fencing for the length of the yard.

I appreciate you can probably read this and think im a numpty, but after having recommendations about these guys I really didnt think there was going to be a problem, and we were in need of the work doing as quickly as possible as our original landscaper had let us down.

harrys_dad

No, I am not going to judge you at all. We all make mistakes and suffer from the consequences.

Purplebat79

Thankyou, appreciate that. Feel pretty bad about it all, especially paying for the blooming thing in the first place.

Well so far they haven't shown up today. My partner went to the showroom to speak to them yesterday and it got heated and the guy swore abuse at my other half so i wasnt entirely convinced they would turn up.

CAB have been in touch and advised writing a letter using their template stating how we would like to resolve the issue and what action we will take if the company do not satisfactorily resolve the issue. Will do that tonight if I have no contact with the company. Wish me luck :-/

Purplebat79

Apologies I stand corrected. They have arrived, and my partner has already produced a letter as per CAB instructions and given it to the lads (re: supply of goods & services act etc). The main gaffer has not attended, and the other lads have discussed the letter on the phone with him. They have accused us of causing the wobbly post as we removed the wheels (which were causing a trip hazard in a public place and werent even touching the floor). Despite the fact that the cross beam was supposedly in place to stop the posts from moving whilst setting and the gates had moved well before the wheels were put on in the first place.

He will be calling us back later once he has read the letter.
I am open to negotiation, Im sure he wants me off his back as much as I want him out of my back yard.

Purplebat79

Update. Thoughts appreciated!

Had a call back, apparently the size of the gates was calculated for the gap size not the actual gates themselves. So we lose a few inches because of gate framework. Why he failed to mention this when we first disputed it ive no idea. But we can live with that and put that down to our experience. I thought we'd made the size clear.
The guy says his offer is to come and replace the dodgy post (he claims that it was our fault its cracked and wobbles) and will make alterations to the gates so we are totally happy. His boss (mysterious bloke who shall not be named apparently) refuses to compensate us for damage to my flags but I am assured that the flags will be left as found i.e. Lifted carefully and relaid.
Ok not gonna argue with that. Now ive been told they only want to work when my partner is present, ive been waiting 4 days for a callback regarding start date.
On Wednesday their 7 days will be up (as specified in a letter to them asking for appropriate action to the faults). Im starting to wonder if its easier to give up and get someone else in so ive got a secure yard for my family

unholyangel

Purplebat79 wrote: »

Update. Thoughts appreciated!

Had a call back, apparently the size of the gates was calculated for the gap size not the actual gates themselves. So we lose a few inches because of gate framework. Why he failed to mention this when we first disputed it ive no idea. But we can live with that and put that down to our experience. I thought we'd made the size clear.
The guy says his offer is to come and replace the dodgy post (he claims that it was our fault its cracked and wobbles) and will make alterations to the gates so we are totally happy. His boss (mysterious bloke who shall not be named apparently) refuses to compensate us for damage to my flags but I am assured that the flags will be left as found i.e. Lifted carefully and relaid.
Ok not gonna argue with that. Now ive been told they only want to work when my partner is present, ive been waiting 4 days for a callback regarding start date.
On Wednesday their 7 days will be up (as specified in a letter to them asking for appropriate action to the faults). Im starting to wonder if its easier to give up and get someone else in so ive got a secure yard for my family

You've already sent them a letter before action or was it just a notice stating the faults and what solution you wanted?

Purplebat79

The letter we sent last Wednesday, it was a template from MSE and also the same format that CAB recommended which stated the faults we weren't happy with, quoted the supply of goods and services act. It stated that we required a satisfactory resolution or full response to the letter or we would seek legal advice to take it further.

Technically I suppose we got a "response" to the letter by phone on Wednesday evening whereby the guy offered to fix the problems till we were satisfied and was going to call back once he was in the office to arrange a date to start work. He hasn't called to date.

Having thought about this phone call, if that was the response to my letter do I need to write again if they do not contact us soon? Wondered if they are just being awkward. It's so inconvenient not having secure gates and it's just dragging on.