Paid for parking but still been denied on appeal?

21yrold

Morning guys,

I parked in birmingham city centre like I always do and I paid via parkmobile app (advertised by the council) I will still within my time frame when I returned to my car to find a parking ticket on my window!! They admit I was using parkmobile and I was in credit when the ticket was issued lol? They can't be serious can they?
What are my options?

I've had the following reply back from them:


Thank you for your enquiry concerning the Penalty Charge Notice detailed above.

The Penalty Charge Notice was issued to your vehicle for being parked without clearly displaying a valid pay & display ticket.

I have noted your comments that you had arranged parking using the Parkmobile application. However, upon checking our records, I can confirm that parking was arranged for vehicle registration number W292GBV. Therefore upon checking your vehicle, the Civil Enforcement Officer was unable to determine a valid parking payment for your vehicle, thus the Penalty Charge Notice was correctly issued,

I must advise you that it is the driver's responsibility to ensure that valid parking is arranged for their vehicle. In this instance it would have been advisable to have ensured that all the information was correct before leaving your vehicle unattended.

Therefore I must rely on the observations of the Civil Enforcement Officer and regret that I am unable to withdraw the Penalty Charge Notice.

In accordance with Birmingham City Council's Discretion Policy, each case is judged on its own merits, taking into account the exceptionality of the circumstances. The decision to enforce this case has therefore been made in accordance with this policy which can be viewed on https://www.birmingham.gov.uk/pcnhttp://www.birmingham.gov.uk/pcn.

You may still take advantage of the reduced charge of £25.00 if payment for the Penalty Charge Notice is received by the 02/10/2013, however the discounted rate is not available after this date. If payment is not received within this time, the full charge of £50.00 will be due.

If you would like to make payment by credit or debit card, please telephone 0845 260 2700, (calls to this number will be free of charge for BT customers and for non BT customers calls will be charged at the local rate. Calls from a mobile will vary), this service is available 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, or pay on-line https://www.birmingham.gov.uk/PCNhttp://www.birmingham.gov.uk/PCN. Please have the Penalty Charge Notice number and your credit card details available.

Alternatively, cheques or Postal Orders should be made payable to 'Birmingham City Council (Highways)' and forwarded to Birmingham City Council, Local Services Directorate PO Box 77 Birmingham B4 7WA, quoting the Penalty Charge Notice number.

If you choose not to send payment in response to this letter, but wish to challenge the matter further and you are the registered keeper of the vehicle, please wait until the formal Notice to Owner is sent to you. This letter offers the opportunity to make a formal representation against the Penalty Charge Notice. Legislation requires the Council to send a formal Notice to Owner to the registered keeper of the vehicle if payment is not made in relation to the Penalty Charge Notice. If you are not the keeper, formal representations may still be made on your behalf by contacting the registered keeper of the vehicle.

peter_the_piper

My suggestion would be to post also on pepipoo.com as well to give a wider range of advice but its likely you will have to go to PATAS to get them to see sense.
How far removed from your VRM was the one on the booking?

21yrold

Hi Peter,

Having just read it again i've only just realised i clicked the wrong car to park I know have 2 cars (inbetween cars) and i was on my way to see someone in hospital so much not have been thinking correctly

I presume from this i have no leg to stand on!

AnnieO1234

And the attendant is supposed to be a mind reader?

21yrold

Not that i should reply to your comment but i will.

I've had tickets issued in the past as the attendent has failed to check like they are supposed to if the car has used via the app so i presumed this had happened again.

Thanks for the useful comment Annie but keep them to yourself next time, i've paid the fine as soon as i realised my mistake.

Coupon-mad

21yrold wrote: »

Hi Peter,

Having just read it again i've only just realised i clicked the wrong car to park I know have 2 cars (inbetween cars) and i was on my way to see someone in hospital so much not have been thinking correctly

I presume from this i have no leg to stand on!

You DO have a leg to stand on!! :eek:

Appeal it again when you get the Notice to Owner - ask them to forward a copy of the Traffic Order that applies and make sure you cite this case:

http://www.trafficpenaltytribunal.gov.uk/downloads/BM07586G_1_.pdf

...this was a decision by the Chief Adjudicator herself (nationally) and oooooh look it was...Birmingham Council!!

''While the CEO cannot be criticised for issuing the PCN, in my view the Council should have immediately cancelled this penalty charge since they had in their own system proof that Doctor Evans had paid £3.30 for parking the car. He had no means of knowing when he left the car park that his payment had been recorded against his own car rather than Miss Price's but it was clear when he explained in his letter of 20 September what had happened.''

It turned on the fact that there had been no contravention of a Traffic Order, in that case.

21yrold wrote: »

i've paid the fine as soon as i realised my mistake.

Oh dear...and that's exactly what this Council (who knew full well the Chief Adjudicator's views) wanted you to believe you had to do.

AnnieO1234 wrote: »

And the attendant is supposed to be a mind reader?

No Annie, but then again people like you with unhelpful inflexible minds were never meant to be Chief Parking Adjudicators either (thank goodness).

21yrold

Coupon-mad wrote: »

You DO have a leg to stand on!! :eek:

Appeal it again when you get the Notice to Owner - ask them to forward a copy of the Traffic Order that applies and make sure you cite this case:

http://www.trafficpenaltytribunal.gov.uk/downloads/BM07586G_1_.pdf

...this was a decision by the Chief Adjudicator herself (nationally) and oooooh look it was...Birmingham Council!!

''While the CEO cannot be criticised for issuing the PCN, in my view the Council should have immediately cancelled this penalty charge since they had in their own system proof that Doctor Evans had paid £3.30 for parking the car. He had no means of knowing when he left the car park that his payment had been recorded against his own car rather than Miss Price's but it was clear when he explained in his letter of 20 September what had happened.''

It turned on the fact that there had been no contravention of a Traffic Order, in that case.





Oh dear...and that's exactly what this Council (who knew full well the Chief Adjudicator's views) wanted you to believe you had to do.





No Annie, but then again people like you with unhelpful inflexible minds were never meant to be Chief Parking Adjudicators either (thank goodness).

Thats interesting but my only worry is 1) I've already paid the £25 fine on the basis of me being incorrect in car details and 2) you have to enter the car reg (pre saved) unlike the one in this case study which is telephone!

Coupon-mad

21yrold wrote: »

Thats interesting but my only worry is 1) I've already paid the £25 fine on the basis of me being incorrect in car details and 2) you have to enter the car reg (pre saved) unlike the one in this case study which is telephone!

IMHO you would still be most likely to have won at adjudication, especially as that compelling case was on the same patch with a broadly similar issue. You only had to appeal further at NTO stage then try adjudication - and even if you lost it would only have been £50 (but in reality, I think you'd have paid nothing, because most people win at adjudication).

I realise you 'only' paid £25 but I for one do not consider the bribe of the discounted amount to ever be a bargain. Most PCNs can be appealed successfully and you have rushed to pay it, sadly. Next time post on pepipoo forum first and get their opinion on it as almost everyone gets off Council PCNs on there (I post there too).

21yrold

Yeah i shouldnt have paid it so quick i do agree in a sense is the same basis of appeal, I dont think i've ever had a parking ticket before to be honest and was feeling a bit crappy about realising i put the wrong car in etc.

Sorry to have wasted your time but whats done is done and we live and learn, hopefully i dont ever get another but we can never say never!

Thanks

AnnieO1234

Public forum, public comments.